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Topher

Topher

New member
My bran spankin’ new Regional Competition license came in the mail and is burning a hole in my pocket. I’m jumping into club racing this season and need some expert guidance.

A little about me: I live in Athens, GA. and plan to compete in Improved Touring in the Southeast division.
I figure to spend $10-15k on a tow vehicle, $3-5k on an enclosed trailer, and $5-10K on a starter car, and $5-10K for an annual racing budget.

First, everything but the car.

Safety Equipment:
Drivers suit- How much suit do I need? I don’t want to skimp on safety equipment, nor do I want to buy way more suit than necessary. What is the difference between a $700 suit and a $1400 suit? What features should I look for- 2 vs. 3 layer, liner material, boot cut vs. cuffed, weight in gm/sqmt, brands, places to buy?

I also need nomex socks, underwear and a shirt- don’t I? Shoes and gloves- any recommendations?

I tend to get hot, and as I will be in the southeast- should I consider a cool shirt system off the bat, or wait and see?

The dreaded H&N restraint device- HANS vs. Safety Solutions vs. Simpson. Doesn’t the HANS require a specific seat type and belts? Where did that dang goaheadtakethewheel article go?

Getting the car there:

Enclosed trailer- I found a thread on sccaforums on towing that was helpful.

Anything to add? What size (20 vs. 24), what features (lighting, wench, entry ramp, sway control, axles and brakes), what are reliable brands I can get in the Atlanta area?

A 20’ trailer won’t fit in a standard 3 car garage, will it? Options for storing the car and/or trailer offsite?

Tow vehicle- If a 24’ weighs about 4000lbs and the car weighs about 3000lbs then I need about 8000 lbs of towing capacity, right? If I’m looking for a crew cab truck with 50-75k miles on it with this much capacity, what are my options? Ford F150, GMC Sierra 1500, Dodge Ram 1500, Toyota Tundra, anything else? Gas vs. Diesel? Rear wheel drive, four wheel drive?
I won’t be using it for a daily driver, only to haul to 6-8 events/yr.

The Race weekend:
Who crews for you? Hire a local mechanic for the weekend? Bribe my mechanically inclined friends? What options are available for track side mechanical support and then for repairs and maintenance when I’m not racing? How long are you at the track for a race weekend?

The car:
I want to purchase a built, turn key car that I can start racing immediately. So many options on the classifieds- RX-7, ITA miata, ITA Focus or Neon. If you were starting from scratch what would you choose? How do I ensure that the car is legal in its class? How do you test drive a race car? Who can I get to inspect and tech it prior to racing? What does the logbook include?

Race Events:
What events can I compete in with a regional license? What is the difference between IT and Pro-IT? What is an ECR race- does it include IT classes? What is a double national?

And Finally- is it worthwhile to rent a car for the first few races? How much does this cost? I don’t want to spend what could be ½ of my car budget on a one weekend rental. What are some reputable teams to rent from in the southeast?

If there is anyone in the SEDiv that would be willing to spare an hour or so on the phone or at the next event, please let me know.

Thanks,

Topher
 
That's alot of questions in a single post, you might get a better response if you keep it to just a few at a time. I added some answers below and when it says "Google" that just means the question has a million answers/opinion and you'll get the most information to answer the question on Google.

Welcome to racing.


Safety Equipment:
Drivers suit- How much suit do I need? I don’t want to skimp on safety equipment, nor do I want to buy way more suit than necessary. What is the difference between a $700 suit and a $1400 suit? What features should I look for- 2 vs. 3 layer, liner material, boot cut vs. cuffed, weight in gm/sqmt, brands, places to buy?
- Google

I also need nomex socks, underwear and a shirt- don’t I? Shoes and gloves- any recommendations?
- Socks yes, underwear not necessarily - read the GCR when it is required. Google.

I tend to get hot, and as I will be in the southeast- should I consider a cool shirt system off the bat, or wait and see?
- Yes, buy one. One of the best purchases you'll ever make.

The dreaded H&N restraint device- HANS vs. Safety Solutions vs. Simpson. Doesn’t the HANS require a specific seat type and belts? Where did that dang goaheadtakethewheel article go?
-No, not specific seat or belt required but there are HANS only belts. Google.
http://www.goaheadtakethewheel.com/

Getting the car there:

Enclosed trailer- I found a thread on sccaforums on towing that was helpful.

Anything to add? What size (20 vs. 24), what features (lighting, wench, entry ramp, sway control, axles and brakes), what are reliable brands I can get in the Atlanta area?
- Get the 24 and that's from someone who didn't listen to others and bought a 20

A 20’ trailer won’t fit in a standard 3 car garage, will it? Options for storing the car and/or trailer offsite?
-No. Storage lot or self storage.

Tow vehicle- If a 24’ weighs about 4000lbs and the car weighs about 3000lbs then I need about 8000 lbs of towing capacity, right? If I’m looking for a crew cab truck with 50-75k miles on it with this much capacity, what are my options? Ford F150, GMC Sierra 1500, Dodge Ram 1500, Toyota Tundra, anything else? Gas vs. Diesel? Rear wheel drive, four wheel drive?
I won’t be using it for a daily driver, only to haul to 6-8 events/yr.
- Like you I needed a truck for towing only, I had a daily drive. Got a Ram 1500, totaled it towing home from a race when it didn't stop in time. Decided never a half ton to tow again and got a gas F250. Hated towing with it. Finally decided screw it and got a F250 PSD 4x4 Crew and now I daily drive it and love it. My last daily was German. Bottom line, get a 3/4 ton diesel and 2wd is fine.

The Race weekend:
Who crews for you? Hire a local mechanic for the weekend? Bribe my mechanically inclined friends? What options are available for track side mechanical support and then for repairs and maintenance when I’m not racing? How long are you at the track for a race weekend?
- I've never had crew and am just fine with it that way. If you need a hand there are plenty of people around willing to help.

The car:
I want to purchase a built, turn key car that I can start racing immediately. So many options on the classifieds- RX-7, ITA miata, ITA Focus or Neon. If you were starting from scratch what would you choose? How do I ensure that the car is legal in its class? How do you test drive a race car? Who can I get to inspect and tech it prior to racing? What does the logbook include?
-ITS RX-7 or Miata. Read the GCR and learn the car then you know whether it's legal or not. Test drive it at the track or on a dyno. Visual inspection and reputation of seller. Call your region to see about local tech. A logbook has basic car info and your roll bar number. It gets signed at each event.

Race Events:
What events can I compete in with a regional license? What is the difference between IT and Pro-IT? What is an ECR race- does it include IT classes? What is a double national?
- Regional events. No Pro-IT or ECR here so don't know. Double National or NN is two national races in one weekend (Sat and Sun). IT is a regional class only and you have a regional only license. You won't be doing any National (N) or NN races. Double Rationals are a new thing - Regional and National on the same weekend on the track in the same groups at the same time. You can do those.

And Finally- is it worthwhile to rent a car for the first few races? How much does this cost? I don’t want to spend what could be ½ of my car budget on a one weekend rental. What are some reputable teams to rent from in the southeast?
- IMO no. Rentals are about $1000+/weekend, better ones closer to $1500+. Since used race cars are worth nothing in comparison to what they cost to build, just buy one. $5k will get you a decent IT car and $10k will buy you a nice one. You can sell it a year later and break even or only lose a few bucks if you bought right.

If there is anyone in the SEDiv that would be willing to spare an hour or so on the phone or at the next event, please let me know.
-I'm of no help in the SOWDIV but I bet one of the SEDIV people will be willing to help with the local culture.
 
I’m jumping into club racing this season and need some expert guidance.
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A couple of quick comments:

Good to see you have a realisitc veiw of what it is going to take to get into it. You will have a much better time with it in the long run since your eyes are open at the start.

Trailer - for a long time I used an open trailer. Many people still do. It still is not likely to fit in your single car garage (they are wider than you think), but attracts much less attention parked off to the side. Cheaper, easier to tow (read less truck needed).

Crew - agreed, I rarely have dedicated crew with me and it is fine. Don't let this be a big worry. If you can feed people, you will have friends at the track.

Which car to buy? - go to the track or look at results sheets and see what classes appear to be well subscribed and with what kind of cars. Then look at the prep levels allowed in the those classes to see how much time is needed fixing & building custom parts.

How long are you at the track? - when you're in race group 1 you never have enough time in the morning, but you're all done early in the day. When you're in the last run group you get to the track too early and feel like it will be after dinner before your group goes out. Friday's are for getting to the track, get home all wrung out and tired late Sunday and drag into work Monday w/ a big grin.

We're all experts here!

Good luck with it.
 
Yes, go back to Dave's book/website, Go Ahead and Take the Wheel. I a lot of that information is covered.

Become friends (even if you have to bribe them with beer) with someone who is experienced and fast who lives near you. Paddock with them at the races. Best way to learn.

I wouldn't tow an inclosed without a Heavy Duty. 250 or 2500 at least. Tow vehicles are like horse power. You can never have too much.

Good luck!!
 
Topher said:
I tend to get hot, and as I will be in the southeast- should I consider a cool shirt system off the bat, or wait and see?
Click to expand...
I ran 8 years with a helmet blower, then last summer switched to a cool shirt. After two weekends with it I think it was the single best decision I've made.
 
And Finally- is it worthwhile to rent a car for the first few races? How much does this cost? I don’t want to spend what could be ½ of my car budget on a one weekend rental. What are some reputable teams to rent from in the southeast?




Contact Tom Fowler at OPM Autospors in Cumming, GA. He has Miatas, Integras, CRXs for rent and can provide you with support of most any of the Southeast races. 770-886-8199
 
You first have to prioritize your racing goals. Do you want to become a better driver or bag trophies? If you want trophies, get a small car in an under-subscribed class . ITC or so.
If you want to become a better racer, go to big classes. IE; SM or ITA.
Sounds as tho you are not happy fixing a car, the Miata is more for you.
I have 5 or 6 race cars run from my shop, the Miata we just change the oil, pads and wheel bearings. The cost per hour is un beatable. The racing is good. You will have instant feedback on your driving and racing skills. The first 3 cars will lap you ,if you are a beginner.
You may never get a trophy.

The racing cost per hr is directly proportional to race car mass. A 3000# car will cost about 2-3x the amount of a 2000# car. Or more.
That starts the whole domino effect on trailers, tow trucks, tires, etc.
IE, I tow a long way over most weekends, I use a VW race car or Miata, and tow with a 2011 Chevy 2500 Van on an open (3600# gross) trailer. I get 15.4 MPG @ 75 mph. on gas.
I recommend a trailer/ truck combo that keeps the tires and fuel out of the tow truck. My van locks up tight. The fuel goes in the back or seat, of the race cars.
Pickups tow nicer, ride better and are quieter. Vans keep the stuff dry and locked.
If your race trailer and car weighs under around 6000#, you could rent a truck per weekend, as needed. The Miata looks good there also.
If I was starting out again and I had some cash, I would consider the SRF class . The value is retained well and the racing is very good. You can t do many major repairs your self, sealed engines. Sealed engines are good for racing,IMHO.
M
 
seckerich said:
Not playing yet, just to perfect a setup after recent threads. :birra:
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Occupation: Vascular Surgeon?

Good questions, but hard to beleive that someone knowing enough to ask them wouldn't already know the answers or have the ability to find them in 15 minutes of searching. Except the questions about IT/PRO-IT/SAARC/ECR. Nobody understands that.

I suppose it is possible this is on the level, but I'd like to see a name and an explanation of current experience, (IE, how do you know this stuff to start with) before I waste my time answering anything beyond http://www.goaheadtakethewheel.com/

Edit: no offense intended Topher if you are for real. And just to prove it I'll give you this advice, check results of any car you are looking to buy. mylaps.com, check for % of DNF and consistently competetive lap times. I'm pretty sure if you do, you won't mention ITA Focus again.
 
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SEDIV help

Im in the SEDIV and would be more then willing to give you some help. In fact will be at Sebring next weekend and you are more then welcome to come hang out. 386-848-5129.
 
Road Atlanta in March will be a big race. National and Regional and lots of cars to look at the build quality and competitiveness. Look me up (I generally park down by the creek...#36 ITA BMW) and I'll be glad to answer any questions you may still have. Chuck
 
Faketree- I ran across OPM, it might be a good way to get my feet wet prior to deciding on a car and class, if the price is right.

FlyingLizard- Definitely in it for the driving, not the hardware. The Miata is attractive, large fields of cars, good support. A well sorted car runs more in the $10-15k range, from what I've seen. After watching the AARC I'm a little gun shy. My impression is that there are some deep pocket teams that don't mind banging fenders. Might not be the ideal place for a rookie to start. Am I wrong on that one?

I'll probably go with a truck, given the hauling utility around the house. Now its the open vs. closed trailer debate and deciding on how much truck I need. I'll probably store the trailer offsite, and keep the car in the garage when I'm working on it. Why the gas and tires out of the tow vehicle- theft, or safety?

Jimbo- *sigh* I have done my homework and my questions are real.

I've read Dave Gran's articles multiple times. It is helpful, but does not answer enough specifics. I signed up for the mentor program. Again, helpful, but I was assigned a mentor that does not race in IT or even the SCCA.

I've also flagged a race and tried to talk to drivers in person. I was met with a less than friendly attitude when I wasn't interested in purchasing the guy's car. Perhaps it was just who I was unfortunate enough to approach in the paddock.

Hence the reason why I'm crowdsourcing on the forum. There is a ton of info out there, both in Sportscar articles and buried in various message boards. But nothing beats the opportunity to talk to guys who are doing it weekend in a weekend out. I want to learn from their mistakes instead of trying to reinvent the wheel.

So thanks to everyone who has chipped in so far. Darryl- expect a call soon. Prob won't make it to Seabring (9 hr drive!).
Chuck- I'm on call that weekend, but will try to get down there.

I've had people question my credentials before, but never on a racing forum. Yes, I'm a vascular surgeon.
Go to health grades and search Christopher Everett Athens, Ga.

I would refer you to my practice's website but its about 10 years out of date and looks like it was designed by a 5 year old. Should have a new one up in a few weeks.
 
Topher, I run a multi car team out of Atlanta region. I have affordable rentals available including an ITA Honda Civic, ITA Miata, Spec Miata, and a STL/EP Miata. I would be happy to answer any questions you have. PM if yo would like my contact info or rental info.

Tyler Raatz
RoadRace Gear
Arrive and drive rentals
 
ECR is a Southeast Division endurance race series - race length varies but is usually 90 minutes with mandatory 5 minute pit stop. ProIT is an Atlanta Region series for IT cars (Spec Miatas also run as ISM) races are 45 minutes, no pit stop; pays money at the end of the year.

With a regional license you can run any regional SCCA races. Most regional races in the SEDIV are part of the South Atlantic Road Racing Championship (SARRC). You can also run in ECR's and ProIT. You may not run National races unless you have a National license and a car that prepped for a National class. A regional license will usually allow you to run in a concurrent Regional/National, commonly referred to as a "Rational."

Get a copy of "Go Ahead Take The Wheel." I wish it had been around when I was racing. Read the General Competition Rules (GCR). The size makes it look daunting, but it's important that you understand the rules. The unofficial "condensed" version written by John Nesbitt is very helpful for new drivers. It's available on the scca.com site. I believe the link is under Club Racing, then Cars & Rules.
 
I'm in orlando so a bit far to be of much help in person on a regular basis, but I'd look at the following:

Look at hondas and mazdas. in whatever class, their racer support programs are first class (meaning you get halep with tech and parts costs)and their cars are excelent with few exceptions. Both makes also have huge numbers currently racing, so there's a lot of built cars and established knoweldge for the more popular models to help you get started.

you seem focussed on IT, which is smart - good competition, a wide variety of cars, reasonable costs, stable rules. I'd keep a specific class in mind when you make your decisions - basically, what's the level of competition and speed that you find most attractive?

so, with that in mind, look at the 3rd gen Integra GSR, 2nd gen RX7, NB/NC miata/MX5, 99-00 Civic Si, 2.2 and 2.3L Preludes for ITS. 2nd gen Integras and 3rd gen integra LS, CRX, NA (popup headlight) miatas, and various civics for ITA. 1.5L civics, accord LXi, older preludes, protege, and VWs for ITB (Tristen Herberts ARRC winning Golf GTI, for sale now, is a GREAT buy here but VWs make great ITB cars and are the one easy button suggestion outside of honda or mazda I'll make,and they do have a contingency program of some sort). I think ITA/S are the most popular in your area, so you might want to focus there.

trailering info is pretty good so far: 250/2500+ with enclosed trailer, you can get away with less using an open trailer, and you can never have too much truck, but easily can have too little, especially when you need it most. especially with the topography you will be seeing, I'd go bigger on the truck than your first instinct probobly suggests.

and if you would like to discuss IT, SCCA in general, etc... please feel free to email me (link in sig) or call me in the evenings at 407-six17-791eight
 
I just went through pretty much everything you are asking for the most part. I have a blog/thread in my link under STL build if you're interested.

I used goaheadtakethewheel, spoke with Dave Gran about a couple things, and did a lot of research on the forums.

Chip and the Trackspeed guys helped me with a lot of things and also helped me this past weekend.

I went with STL partly due to the car I already owned (modified Civic) and completed the double school at RRR this past weekend with Chip and some others.

I was surrounded by spec miatas for the most part and I think if I personally was going to start fresh and just purchase a vehicle, that would be the way to go.

Good luck!
 
Toper, give me a call when you get a minute (9one9three ARGGHninefivetwothreeYELPonenine).

I'm basically "you" seven years ago. Professional guy, not much mechanical experience, loved racing and just wanted the rush of doing it. That sustained me for the first few years of non-competitiveness and then I wanted to make the big jump up to competitive. I've had a lot of ups and downs, and a lot of help from friends over the years.

As an initial matter, you are asking teh right questions. Here are some answers from my perspective.

Your initial budgeting works. I tow now with a Ram 2500 diesel I bought new in 07 for $33k, but towed for several years with a 99 Suburban 2500 I got for $10k. $10k for a used tow vehicle is reasonable. A newer Tundra, Ram 1500, Ford F-150 or Chevy 1/2 ton will tow 8-9k just fine. Older than the last 5-6 years though and the brakes/chassis might not be up to it.

$10k for a good used IT is spot on. There are several out there for that price now. I'm biased so I'll push ITS, but it is objectively true that ITS is pretty strong -- maybe stronger than any other IT class in the SEDiv right now (although ITA is very strong in the Atlanta region where you are). There are a couple of ITS cars out there that are good cars (a 240sx and a nice RX7) to start with.

$3-4k for a good enclosed is reasonable. I'd go 20 if you can find one. It's plenty of room for a starter trailer. Doubtful you can store it at you house unless you have a parking pad. I pay $120/month to store mine at a storage shed.

Some folks will let you test drive a race car but most won't. I think you are best off buying one that folks around this region "know" to be a good legal car. Once you get it, your local tech inspector (contact Bowie or someone in Atlanta to help you find out who that is) can give it an inspection and yoru "annual" tech. Try to do that BEFORE your first race weekend; nothing worse than showing up and flunking tech and thrashing to make a race.

Regional IT license gets you in all IT events. In the SEDiv we have:

SARRC -- the is the "premiere" year long sprint race series with races from VIR to Daytona to Sebring to Birmingham. Best six finishes count plus the double points year end finally at Roebling. This is my series; very competitive in ITS. 30 min races.

Pro-IT -- 45 min series with small payouts in the Atlanta region. Well run.

CCPS -- 45 min series at CMP in SC and Charlotte.

TarHeel Pro -- New 45 min series at VIR.

ECR -- 1.5 hour or 3 hour enduros. Year long series like SARRC.

Safety. to start, I'd get a cheap three layer suit, the low end OMPs and Sparcos and Momos work fine. With a 3 layer, you don't need underwear but wear it anyway.

Nomex socks you will need.

Crew. It varies for everyone. i started totally by myself, barely knowing how to change brakepads. Somehow, I raced consistently. You can do it yourself, but the best "crew" is having friends at the track (preferably in cars similar to yours) who can help if you have an issue. Most of us in ITS race that way, and help each other when someone has an issue. Good tight group of guys.

I have a friend in Cary who has a lift. He is gracious enough to let me use it some, and I rent a shop near my house for $210/month for "normal" work and parts storage. Find a friend with a lift! lol.....

I also am busy at work, as I suspect you are, and while I do a lot of mechanical work myself, I do farm it out when necessary. Find a local shop you can trust and use them. OPM is top notch.

Call me and we can talk more. And welcome! Of all the things I love about racing, the one I love the most is hanging out with my racing buddies and shooting the shit in the paddock at night after a great day of racing.
 
Chris, One of the first things you need to decide is rear wheel drive or front wheel drive. There are competitive cars in both configurations but the driving dynamics are quite different. You may want to rent each and run for a weekend to see which you like best. Buy vs. build...search this forum for all the arguments for buying. A competitive/winning car will certainly cost more, but realize you are getting more...usually a 99% sorted car so you can go to the track, change tires, check tire pressures, and race. Chuck
 
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