GL Div - CenDiv split, why? Why not fix it now?

shwah

shwah

New member
I was not very active in the division prior to the split, so I don't have a whole lot of past perspective to work from. However, my current view is that the split of our division has had negative impact on all racing regions.

We have fewer regional races than I can find record of in CenDiv this year - 8 races over 5 weekends at 2 tracks (we have two other tracks available but have not run Autobahn since 2006, and may not run Milwaukee Mile again). My impression is that nationals in GLDiv are very weak, and that regionals are not where they used to be either (except for that aweseme event that is IT Festival at Mid-O). CenDiv will probably do fine with nationals, with the Sprints and now that the Runoffs are coming, but regardless we struggle with volunteer staffing for events - will the racing regions usually pooling resources, not just for the Sprints, but for all events.

So my questions are:
What was the goal for the split?
How do we measure the result?
Did it acheive that goal?
If not, why would we not take steps as soon as possible to correct the mistake and bring the divisions back into a single entity?

It is not a horrible thing to try something and be wrong, but it is irrsesponsible to the club to be wrong and refuse to admit/correct the mistake.

Am I way off base on this? Is everything in fact hunky dory in the CD / GLD regions? If so please correct me and explain what I am missing.
 
So my questions are:

What was the goal for the split?

My 2 cents as I'v been told the info. Area 4 wanted it's National dates & more National dates PERIOD. They got their dates & they also got no more car counts from area 5 as they had from area 5 before they received their wanted split.

How do we measure the result?

Quite simple at the National level, the split diluted racing in what was known as area 4 of the old CenDiv. Area 5 car count for Nationals continues to be quite the same as when area 4 was part of the CenDiv. The car count for the Runoffs is greater but IMHJ also diluted because twice as many cars get invited from what was one Divison is now two Divisions. My guess would be that no one in area 4 before the split payed any attention to the number of cars that came through/around Chicago to area 4 races.

No comment on Regional races other than I would suspect the economy is playing a very large part with the car counts along with $4.00 plus for gas & $5.00 plus for diesel. :(
 
Personally, I've liked it since the split. Before it, you would lose the CenDiv Championship to someone you never even raced against all year. That gets old, real quick. So yea, because of that, some of us GLDiv members would venture up that way to compete. But that tow's a real pain in the ass strickly because of Chicago. Now, no need. I still go up to Road America once every couple of years because it's such an awesome track, but it really is too much of a pain to do every year. But now, if I was a national racer, you bet your ass I'd probably be making that trip at least twice a year, so I think you'll see a huge boost in numbers at both the regionals and the nationals up there because of that. After the Runoffs left Mid Ohio, we saw a pretty huge crash in numbers at both, but we're coming back with events like the IT Fest and creative weekends featuring restricted regionals at nationals, chase races, and enduro's. It's a competition for these regions to bring in the racers. If you get creative and increase their incentive to come, they'll come. It's not rocket science.

But back to the point, it was my understanding that Area 4 (CenDiv) wanted to split from Area 5 (GLDiv) more so than the other way around. Now, they seem to be the one's hurting (if they really even are) from it. Well......that sucks. Down here, I can't say I've noticed any adverse affect of it. If anything, it's created a more tightly nit group (at least in the IT community) of the MI, OH, & IN racers as we take on eachother in the GLDiv Championship and take on other drivers from the NEDiv & SEDiv at events like the ARRC and the IT Fest. I like having a more concentrated area to say I'm from. When I say I'm from the GLDiv, I know all of the racers who are behind that statement, and I know the talent within it very well and am proud to say I race there. With how huge the old CenDiv was, you couldn't feel that way.
 
R2 Racing said:
But back to the point, it was my understanding that Area 4 (CenDiv) wanted to split from Area 5 (GLDiv) more so than the other way around. Now, they seem to be the one's hurting (if they really even are) from it.
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Kevin:

You have that backward. Area 4 is GLDIV and Area 5 is CENDIV. I don't know anything more about who wanted to split from who...
 
Indy Region consistently had seen 25% of it's entries (National and Regional) come from Area 5 Cen Div.
We are no longer seeing those numbers.

Indy Region voted AGAINST the split.
 
R2 Racing said:
Personally, I've liked it since the split. Before it, you would lose the CenDiv Championship to someone you never even raced against all year. That gets old, real quick. So yea, because of that, some of us GLDiv members would venture up that way to compete. But that tow's a real pain in the ass strickly because of Chicago. Now, no need. I still go up to Road America once every couple of years because it's such an awesome track, but it really is too much of a pain to do every year.
....

I like having a more concentrated area to say I'm from. When I say I'm from the GLDiv, I know all of the racers who are behind that statement, and I know the talent within it very well and am proud to say I race there. With how huge the old CenDiv was, you couldn't feel that way.
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Those are some great points Kevin. I feel like the IT racers in CenDiv have a pretty good handle on who all the other guys they race against are also. We also get a bit of a 'team' feeling when we talk about traveling to the IT Fest or ARRC (or at least the ITB guys do). That sounds like a positive change to me.

I just hope that the end result is not weaker regions and/or events in general. I'm not confident that this is the case, but from what feels like an 'outside view' that is what it looks like.
 
My two cents. Larger regions ( 1,000 members +) not being able to get along with each other. Now that the run-offs have moved to Road America ( within one of those Huge regions) I doubt you will ever see things combined again.:(
 
planet6racing said:
Kevin:

You have that backward. Area 4 is GLDIV and Area 5 is CENDIV. I don't know anything more about who wanted to split from who...
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Sorry, my fault. I can't say that I know who wanted the split to happen the most either. I just interpreted from the original post that it was the (what is now known as) CenDiv. Could be wrong.:shrug:
 
I don't really know either. I did have one person tell me they thought Area 4 wanted it, in search of an additional national race.

I was hoping that others would be more tuned into the real story.
 
shwah said:
I don't really know either. I did have one person tell me they thought Area 4 wanted it, in search of an additional national race.

I was hoping that others would be more tuned into the real story.
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Chris, the first sentence in TAC's reply above is the key. There were constant scheduling struggles.
 
Yep the scheduling issues were the big problem. Some hard headed people who were in charge of certain regions were not willing to work together to put together a schedule that would work for the majority of the regions and racers.

Now this was a huge mistake in my opinion. It has diluted the racer pool and also stretched the available workers. One National was canceled, and others have had poor turnouts in 2008. This was a bad idea from the beginning, and has only gotten worse. The only positive I've seen is a smaller schedule. Although in CenDiv having only 5 National races is too few, having 20 Regional races and 11 National races were too many IMO.

Chris, I'll be a Blackhawk on the 12th. Look forward to seeing you then !!
 
According to DLBracing, there are only about 20 people registered for the Blackhawk Regional. I'm hoping a lot more mailed in their registrations, else I fear that this might get cancelled...
 
Drew Aldred said:
Yep the scheduling issues were the big problem. Some hard headed people who were in charge of certain regions were not willing to work together to put together a schedule that would work for the majority of the regions and racers.

QUOTE]

Ding...ding...ding... We have a winner. The schedualing conflicts have been huge in the past. And yea, part of that was ego, but there could be races 10 hours a part that regions would fight for dates and the oppposite region wouldn't budge becuase they felt the other race would hurt thier car count. With the price of gas, that doesn't seem to be much of an issue anymore.
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I don't know why folks are slow to register for the Firecracker, but I know 3 additional ITB drivers are planning to be there, and a 4th and 5th that always are there, but I have not talked to them. Light but not empty turnout for my class.

See you there Drew.

edit - if this gets cancelled I will be screwed. Aaron took the win from me there in April. I have an edge on him here, he has an edge on me at RA. Our championship would only be changed by him not finishing a race if we don't get to go at BHF for the double.
 
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You guys maybe think that the $4/gallon gas and damn near everything else in life costing more this year than ever before, just maybe having something to do with lower car counts?
 
sure it does Kevin.

while some of the things you point out are positives, you need to look at this from a more macro view. i think MiDiv has a lot of similarities to the old CenDiv before the split, with our massive geographical area, scheduling conflicts, and entry problems.

from Kansas City to Memphis (the SE corner of the Div), it's a 10hr haul. but Kansas City isn't even close to the NW corner, that's up in central Nebraska. so from corner track to corner track, you're looking at 15hr+ tow. that's just loony, and people don't do it. we are for the most part divided into an IA/NE/KS/MO and MO/IL/OK/TN subdivisions, with the regional racers from each not seeing each other all year. to solve this, there is a double points race in October for anyone who has scored in 4 or more MiDiv championship races, which basically means if you want to finish well for the season, you have to go. the race rotates tracks every 2 years. i hate the track in STL, but i hauled my ass out there last october....because i had to.

last year the scheduling was awful. there was something like 7 races in 8 weekends during july & aug (who wants to be racing in that heat in this part of the country?). every region lost their ass hosting races, KC region who hosts events at HPT was thousands in the red for last year's double regional in july. i think we ended up with ~70 entries.

this year KC region took the initiative to reduce the # of races we held, and have been much better off for it imo. the double regional (moved to june) drew over 100 entries, and i'm sure the only National we have later in the year will do well.

bottom line?
i think undoing the split and forcing the two sides to work together (even if that means losing a bunch of money for a year) would be best for the health of the divisions, and the SCCA as a whole.
 
As a counter point to the benefits of the split - know where you are racing, who you are racing against, and race against your competition in the championship.

The current arrangement discourages running some events. For example, I have been wanting to race at Grattan for the past few years, but I have not had time/budget outside our CenDiv races to go and do it. I have run lots and lots of laps at Gingerman, that is where I got started with the whole track day thing, but I have never raced there. We are going to IT Fest this year, but until the Milwaukee regional race got cancelled it was going to be a serious squeeze for us.

Since divisional series don't score any out of division events (ala national points systems) it ends up preventing folks from going to new tracks and racing new competition - excepting the truely dedicated.

As a result, next year I will probably not contest my local series, and focus on hitting some new tracks, and racing some new drivers. I will go to Grattan, and I will find a weekend to go race against Chris and the other MidDiv ITB guys.
 
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