Qualifying sessions or qualifying races?
- Thread starter mtownneon
- Start date
lawtonglenn
New member
iambhooper
New member
I've never been in a qualifying race... how do they decide on the starting grid for a qualifier?
I would be concerned about the possibiity of other drivers making bonehead race moves during the quilifier and causing accidents.. just to get a better spot on the grid. (example would be the ITB Volvo at VIR that had "brake problems", yet bonzaid 1, t-boneing an ITA car.
I would rather have a 25 or 30 min qualifier, as opposed to having a 10-15 min practiece and 10-15 min qualifier.
I would be concerned about the possibiity of other drivers making bonehead race moves during the quilifier and causing accidents.. just to get a better spot on the grid. (example would be the ITB Volvo at VIR that had "brake problems", yet bonzaid 1, t-boneing an ITA car.
I would rather have a 25 or 30 min qualifier, as opposed to having a 10-15 min practiece and 10-15 min qualifier.
gran racing
Super Moderator
To me, 25 - 30 minutes for qualifying is a waste of time. Get out there and get the job done, then begin racing! I'd prefer a short qualifying then as many races as possible and don't care if it has to be called a qual race or a standard race for whatever reasons.
lawtonglenn
New member
hoop
when we have a double, this format changes it to a triple...
from . . to
qual . . qual
race . . race
qual . . race
race . . race
.
when we have a double, this format changes it to a triple...
from . . to
qual . . qual
race . . race
qual . . race
race . . race
.
Dave Zaslow
New member
Qual > Race > Race has also been used at the July Sprints at WGI with success. I believe second race is gridded by fastest 1st race lap.
Good format.
DZ
Good format.
DZ
Doesn't really matter much, but for the "Double in a Day" we used at Nelson this year it was a random drawing at registration for first qualifying race, the results thereof setting the grid for the first "race" and the results of the "first" race set the grid for the "Second" race.
Worked well and was a ton of fun!
Worked well and was a ton of fun!
Andy Bettencourt
Super Moderator
The most popular weekends up here are doubles/triples that look like this:
Sat AM qual
Sat PM race
Sun AM qual race (grid based on Sat PM fast lap)
Sun PM race (grid based on finish position from Sun AM race)
Schools, test days and most HPDE clubs provide much better value for 'track time'. Race weekends should maximize RACING.
Inverted grids do not reward the fast drivers (isn't that what this is about?) and puts slower drivers in a situation that they don't need to be in so early in the race.
Sat AM qual
Sat PM race
Sun AM qual race (grid based on Sat PM fast lap)
Sun PM race (grid based on finish position from Sun AM race)
Schools, test days and most HPDE clubs provide much better value for 'track time'. Race weekends should maximize RACING.
Inverted grids do not reward the fast drivers (isn't that what this is about?) and puts slower drivers in a situation that they don't need to be in so early in the race.
Western New York Region has traditionally used the Qualifying session, then a Qualifying Race (Saturday) format, then used the finishing results of Saturday's shorter race as Grid positions for Sunday's grand finale, a longer race.
Depending on track time scheduling, the Saturday races were either ten or fifteen laps, and Sunday's was twenty.
If the competitor was unable to race on Sunday (mechanical, illness, etc), we were able to allow points for the Saturday race, so the weekend was not a total loss.
It was always well received, and has been used for, maybe, fifteen years or so.
Bill
Depending on track time scheduling, the Saturday races were either ten or fifteen laps, and Sunday's was twenty.
If the competitor was unable to race on Sunday (mechanical, illness, etc), we were able to allow points for the Saturday race, so the weekend was not a total loss.
It was always well received, and has been used for, maybe, fifteen years or so.
Bill
mc-integra111
New member
It sounds like I'm in the minority, but here is what I like:
- I like the first session of a weekend to be practice (work out cobwebs, learn tracks, learn competitors, etc.)
- I like at least 1 classic qualifying session, fast time wins.
- After that, I would like multiple races. I would not like grid sports to be determined by finishing position, but rather fast lap as several have suggested.
- Generally I would like more shorter duration races (rather than less longer races). I find that a great majority of the time I do not gain or lose any positions in the last 5 laps or so (maybe 2-3 for big tracks like RA), so I would prefer re-gridding and going at it again.
- I like the first session of a weekend to be practice (work out cobwebs, learn tracks, learn competitors, etc.)
- I like at least 1 classic qualifying session, fast time wins.
- After that, I would like multiple races. I would not like grid sports to be determined by finishing position, but rather fast lap as several have suggested.
- Generally I would like more shorter duration races (rather than less longer races). I find that a great majority of the time I do not gain or lose any positions in the last 5 laps or so (maybe 2-3 for big tracks like RA), so I would prefer re-gridding and going at it again.
iambhooper
New member
Ok, this makes sense. But it really only seems to work on Double races. Does the qualifying race count as a seperate sanction? So that would be 3 sanctions in 1 weekend?
As for advancing late in the race... i'm thi opposite. I tend to have better finish's than I do starts. 10 or 15 min of track time is a waste of my time.
hoop
From lambhooper:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Bettencourt
The most popular weekends up here are doubles/triples that look like this:
Sat AM qual
Sat PM race
Sun AM qual race (grid based on Sat PM fast lap)
Sun PM race (grid based on finish position from Sun AM race)
Ok, this makes sense. But it really only seems to work on Double races. Does the qualifying race count as a seperate sanction? So that would be 3 sanctions in 1 weekend?
No, one sanction for the whole weekend with the format I stated for WNY. "Sanction" covers the event, not the number of races held during the event.
Incidentally, I mispoke when I listed a practice session. I should have stated Practice/Qualifying session.
Good racing.
Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Bettencourt
The most popular weekends up here are doubles/triples that look like this:
Sat AM qual
Sat PM race
Sun AM qual race (grid based on Sat PM fast lap)
Sun PM race (grid based on finish position from Sun AM race)
Ok, this makes sense. But it really only seems to work on Double races. Does the qualifying race count as a seperate sanction? So that would be 3 sanctions in 1 weekend?
No, one sanction for the whole weekend with the format I stated for WNY. "Sanction" covers the event, not the number of races held during the event.
Incidentally, I mispoke when I listed a practice session. I should have stated Practice/Qualifying session.
Good racing.
Bill
dickita15
New member
We (NER) have used both one or two sanctions for this type of triple. Two sanctions cost the region more but count as two races for license purposes so it is a trade off.
At times the “triples” have given three set of points for one series (NERRC) but only the two PM races count for another series (NARRC).
RacerBill
New member
The IT Spec*Tacular and the OVR Double Championship races at Mid-Ohio use the double sanction option. Therefore the race on Saturday, and one of the races on Sunday can count towards you license.
