STUPID RULES

[dj10]

Everyone has some pet peeves about rules in racing. I'd like to see a list of the rules and racing phrases like "rule creep", that really blows your SKIRTS UP! No matter what organization it might be with, I'd like to see and read them. Maybe we can get them to the Late Show since Letterman is a race team owner. This is a good way to get some of this in the open and off your chest's. Ya never know, maybe we can fix some of them. I guess common sense doesn't always prevail.

From me:

Windshield washer bottles. WHO THE F&*( ever heard of a real RACECAR that had to have one of these??!!

Here's one, @ NASA runoffs last year, they had people checking to see if you had nomex socks on!!!!!! HAS ANYONE EVER HEARD OF SOME DYING FROM BURNT FEET? Next they'll have some sticking their heads down the drivers suit to see if they have nomex under wear on.

 

[JohnRW]

Here's one, @ NASA runoffs last year, they had people checking to see if you had nomex socks on!!!!!! [/b]

You've never done an SCCA race at Lime Rock, have you ?

 

[charrbq]

I used to work grid with a woman who pulled just that stunt. It was a long time ago when double layered suits weren't the vogue. She had a couple of drivers that had continuously been a$$holes (long story). Just before the 5 minute warning she had tech announce that there would be an underwear check for all drivers. Everyone complained but complied immediately except for the two offensive drivers. They left the grid and had to get redressed before the one minute warning. They didn't make it, but they never gave her trouble again.

As to the socks, when working grid, one of my people noticed that a fairly young driver of an SM was standing and chatting with the other drivers and was wearing a pretty worn out pair of mesh top athletic shoes with "gym" socks. I had to confront the driver about his gear. His father, standing nearby, jumped down my throat with both feet and told me that it was perfectly safe and that he always drove that way. I politely told him that he wasn't going out on the course until completely dressed appropriately. Much fussing and cursing proceeded on dad's part. Both retreated to the race gear dealer and purchased the proper equipment. Since it was practice, little time was lost.
The boy's father latter apologized to me for being nasty. He said he was only trying to safe money as the kid was growing in sizes daily.

As for checking socks on a driver in a car...I've got too much to do before releasing drivers onto the track. If tech has a bunch of spare people (I doubt it) they can check them. As for their need, yes, they're needed. If you've ever seen a burn patient (from even the smallest burn) going through rehab, you'd agree. However, I hate wearing them while driving. I don't see how they work as they are so thin, but that's not my call.

Pet peeves.... Why, if you have an exposed filler pipe for the fuel, do you have to cover it? The neck, the filler, the vent, and the tank are all of the same guage metal. Yet it has to be covered with either a thin piece of metal, or the stock plastic (i.e. flammable) interior panel. Makes little sense in terms of safety.

 

[Andy Bettencourt]

Pet peeves.... Why, if you have an exposed filler pipe for the fuel, do you have to cover it? The neck, the filler, the vent, and the tank are all of the same guage metal. Yet it has to be covered with either a thin piece of metal, or the stock plastic (i.e. flammable) interior panel. Makes little sense in terms of safety. [/b]

I didn't remember this and a quick scan of the GCR has me wondering what rule you are talking about.

 

[dj10]

I used to work grid with a woman who pulled just that stunt. It was a long time ago when double layered suits weren't the vogue. She had a couple of drivers that had continuously been a$$holes (long story). Just before the 5 minute warning she had tech announce that there would be an underwear check for all drivers. Everyone complained but complied immediately except for the two offensive drivers. They left the grid and had to get redressed before the one minute warning. They didn't make it, but they never gave her trouble again.

As to the socks, when working grid, one of my people noticed that a fairly young driver of an SM was standing and chatting with the other drivers and was wearing a pretty worn out pair of mesh top athletic shoes with "gym" socks. I had to confront the driver about his gear. His father, standing nearby, jumped down my throat with both feet and told me that it was perfectly safe and that he always drove that way. I politely told him that he wasn't going out on the course until completely dressed appropriately. Much fussing and cursing proceeded on dad's part. Both retreated to the race gear dealer and purchased the proper equipment. Since it was practice, little time was lost.
The boy's father latter apologized to me for being nasty. He said he was only trying to safe money as the kid was growing in sizes daily.

As for checking socks on a driver in a car...I've got too much to do before releasing drivers onto the track. If tech has a bunch of spare people (I doubt it) they can check them. As for their need, yes, they're needed. If you've ever seen a burn patient (from even the smallest burn) going through rehab, you'd agree. However, I hate wearing them while driving. I don't see how they work as they are so thin, but that's not my call.

Pet peeves.... Why, if you have an exposed filler pipe for the fuel, do you have to cover it? The neck, the filler, the vent, and the tank are all of the same guage metal. Yet it has to be covered with either a thin piece of metal, or the stock plastic (i.e. flammable) interior panel. Makes little sense in terms of safety. [/b]

Thank you, this is great stuff, keep them coming!! And no I haven't or will I ever race Lime Rock Park since you will get bitched at for farting to loudly and only on Sundays.

As for burns, I've had and seen my share. The ironic part is that no one in racing has ever died from burnt feet and this is my only point.

I didn't remember this and a quick scan of the GCR has me wondering what rule you are talking about.

[/b]

Andy, I'm just trying to let everyone vent alittle. I want to keep the humor in this, a lot of these could lead to some good stories. Do you have any?

 

[dickita15]

Ok I will play, a couple of years ago at the Glen we had one of those races where we spent a lot of time behind the Pace Car. 3 laps of green and the 5 very slow laps of full course yellow, 2 laps of green and then yellow again for 3 or 4 laps. I was hot there was no air moving and the rotary puts out some heat. After we took the checker I took of my gloves. I spent years flagging and always wave to the workers. By about half way around the cool off lap the flaggers were all yelling at me to put my gloves back on. I kept waving. Sure enough I was pulled over in the pits and scolded by a steward for a few minutes. Kept my helmet on and just nodded. I could not hear a word he was saying.

 

[Andy Bettencourt]

Vent away, but lets make them legit.

 

[Xian]

I didn't remember this and a quick scan of the GCR has me wondering what rule you are talking about.
[/b]

I think he's referring to this verbiage:

In any automobile where allowed removal of rear seats, upholstery, etc., creates an opening between the driver/passenger compartment and an exposed gas tank, fuel cell, or part thereof, a metal bulkhead which completely fills such opening shall be installed (See GCR 9.3.26.1.)

This is from 9.1.3 E in the IT portion of the GCR. In Civic/CRX's the removal of the interior panels or rear seats causes the fuel filler neck to become "exposed"...

Christian

 

[jackedrabbit]

Maybe not stupid,but I don't really understand the reasoning behind not being able to remove heater hoses or the heater core,while being able to block them.

 

[its66]

Unless you have NASCAR bars protruding into your doors, you are required to keep your windows, and keep them functional, but you aren't allowed to use them. hhmmm..

 

[dj10]

Ok I will play, a couple of years ago at the Glen we had one of those races where we spent a lot of time behind the Pace Car. 3 laps of green and the 5 very slow laps of full course yellow, 2 laps of green and then yellow again for 3 or 4 laps. I was hot there was no air moving and the rotary puts out some heat. After we took the checker I took of my gloves. I spent years flagging and always wave to the workers. By about half way around the cool off lap the flaggers were all yelling at me to put my gloves back on. I kept waving. Sure enough I was pulled over in the pits and scolded by a steward for a few minutes. Kept my helmet on and just nodded. I could not hear a word he was saying.
[/b]

I've seen may Pro drivers do this as well as taking of helmets and hanging out open doors. I wondered if Hans Stuck ever got yelled at? Lesson: Don't wave to corner workers with gloves off. hehe

Maybe not stupid,but I don't really understand the reasoning behind not being able to remove heater hoses or the heater core,while being able to block them. [/b]

Hmm, makes you wonder???

 

[Ron Earp]

Must keep power steering functional if your car came with it? (And you can't backdate/change because all of "your car" had a power steering pump)

But in SM they can be disabled and SM is "supposed" to be more limited prep than IT.....

R

 

[dj10]

Unless you have NASCAR bars protruding into your doors, you are required to keep your windows, and keep them functional, but you aren't allowed to use them. hhmmm.. [/b]

Yea, why DO they have to be functional?

Must keep power steering functional if your car came with it? (And you can't backdate/change because all of "your car" had a power steering pump)

But in SM they can be disabled and SM is "supposed" to be more limited prep than IT.....

R [/b]

Interesting!

BTW Ron, I love the guys kicking each other off the cliff.

 

[Greg Amy]

Why, if you have an exposed filler pipe for the fuel, do you have to cover it?[/b]

Infrared radiation. While thin sheet metal may not be able to stop a propagating flame for long, it will do a damn fine job of blocking radiating heat from melting the fuel lines...

Try taking a thinnest piece of sheet metal and putting it in front of your face while you stand next to a campfire and you'll see what I mean.

 

[JohnRW]

I've seen may Pro drivers do this as well as taking of helmets and hanging out open doors. I wondered if Hans Stuck ever got yelled at? [/b]

Yup...WGI in the late 80's...IMSA race...they got all wiggy about it...it was the beginning of the 'dark period' at WGI. But...he had a pretty good 'yodel' on the podium.

 

[dj10]

Infrared radiation. While thin sheet metal may not be able to stop a propagating flame for long, it will do a damn fine job of blocking radiating heat from melting the fuel lines...

Try taking a thinnest piece of sheet metal and putting it in front of your face while you stand next to a campfire and you'll see what I mean. [/b]

So in essence, your saying two layers of sheet metal or other materials are what they want for addition safety? Why would they want to use a material such as plastic which would only contribute as an additional fuel for the fire?

 

[lateapex911]

At Watkins Glen, you pull off disabled and stop. The whole course goes yellow, while the tow truck trundles out to pull the car. You pull off your helmet, and then jump in the tow truck for a ride. Nope...no riding unless fully dressed...put that helmet back on you raidical enemy of all things safe.

Yup, ole Bubba is in a T-shirt and jeans, but YOU have to be fully kitted up.

Most uptight place I've been to.....

 

[dj10]

Yup...WGI in the late 80's...IMSA race...they got all wiggy about it...it was the beginning of the 'dark period' at WGI. But...he had a pretty good 'yodel' on the podium. [/b]

But it never stopped him. :026:

At Watkins Glen, you pull off disabled and stop. The whole course goes yellow, while the tow truck trundles out to pull the car. You pull off your helmet, and then jump in the tow truck for a ride. Nope...no riding unless fully dressed...put that helmet back on you raidical enemy of all things safe.

Yup, ole Bubba is in a T-shirt and jeans, but YOU have to be fully kitted up.

Most uptight place I've been to.....
[/b]

Same way in NASA, they'll fine you $50.00 if you aren't fully dressed.

 

[Off Camber]

IT Rules. 9-a
The Drivers seat only my be replaced by a race seat.

So you can leave the original passenger seat in but you cant replace it with a race seat.

 

[MMiskoe]

Washer bottles - well actually I've now taken the time on two cars to hook them up & make them work. Very necessary when driving in crappy weather & everyone keeps going off & coming back on track w/ mud.

And yes, NER can ask for some odd things - we had to surrender our helmets after qualifying this summer, to get them back we had to bring our factory manuals. I think there was one RX7 manual that got brought into the tech shed about 9 times, guys just waited outside the door for their turn with it.

But here you go with some of my favorites:

Why can't we have jack pads? How many cars have you seen w/ big crunch marks on the underside from jacks? Its not like a jack point really adds "competitive advantage", it just keeps the car from getting beat up, or falling on your head.

Why can't we put a vent window in the rear window? No, lets mount the thing in the front window where it either is less effective or blocks our view (or both).

So you can't have anything lower than the wheel rim - except the exhaust. First, why is the exhaust exempt? Second, w/ a 50 series tire (or 45) if its that low, its going to get ripped off and land in the track.

You can run any kind of radiator and engine oil cooler, any kind of diff set up (in the stock pumpkin). Why not a diff cooler?

Fuel testing.... Well, I'll be polite and leave that one alone. I think every knows why the rule got created, but it didn't get very well thought out before being implemented such that nothing that will burn in the car will actually pass. There's no good solution on that one.


Matt