Towing rig survey

F

FASTJACK

New member
Hi,

Haven't posted much yet - just getting back into doing some racing now that the kids are growing up and I'm gaining some free time back. So I'm sitting here looking at the snow outside the mind wanders.....to future plans. What to buy as the next Tow Rig.
Looking for thoughts and opinions from others to either validate, or change my current opinions.

I tow now with an 1987 Ford E250 Clubwagon, but it's getting pretty long in tooth, and rusty to boot! Carb needs another rebuild, and floors are going, but runs and tows well when it's well warmed up.

So, here's the question(s):

#1: firstly, I'm trying to decide on if I'm going to stick with a van or move to a pickup.

I haul wood very regularly, and sheet goods, so a 8ft bed is a must (my current van is not the super long chassis, so with the bench seat in it is only a 6ft floor, kinda sucks taking it in and out all the time as ness).
Also, an extended cab or long chassis van is a must so I can haul my kids if need be, and is better for towing anyways. (long wheelbase)

2nd question: Ford or GM?

I'm predisposed towards a Ford as I know them better, and have anecdotally seen better logivity with the C6 or AOD than a TH400 or some of the nwer GM trans when hauling and towing regularly.

3rd qeustion: Gas or diesel.

4th: IL6, 302, 351 or 7.3 D (Ford) GM 5.7 or other small V8?

I only tow a small trailer and car, so absolute power really isn't an issue, gas milage might be, but will the smaller V8's or 6 do the job running around New England? Also in the future some 2 horse trailer towing may happen (wife and daughters fun).

5th: 150/250/350? 1500,2500,3500? F or E series?

I like the bigger brakes on the 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks, but maybe I could get away with 1/2 ton? I also like the bigger payload too, and there are a LOT more 150's out there to pick from.

6th and final: 4x4 or 2 wheel drive?

My van is almost un-drivable in the snow, as are most 2wd pickups, so I'm leaning towards a 4x4 (eliminating most vans unless it's a big buck Quigley or Quadra, which is too rich for me) in order to get a reasonably useable vehicle in the snow.

My dream truck? Maybe a F250 extended cab 4x4 with a 351 fuelie, 8ft bed, resonable highway tires (not mudders), not rusty!
2nd choice, a E250/350 Quigley with extended chassis, highway rubber, 351. Maybe a 7.3 D ...... though I'm always worried about wood I'm hauling smashing a Clubwagon's rear windows.

What do YOU think?

Jack
 
I would go with an F-250. I assume that you are in the rust belt. Just a quick search within 300 miles of Pgh, PA netted this find.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=256440207&dealer_id=75313&car_year=1990&rdm=1231286140571&model=F250&num_records=25&systime=&make2=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&start_year=1981&keywordsfyc=&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&keywordsrep=&engine=&certified=&body_code=0&fuel=&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=300&marketZipError=false&search_lang=en&showZipError=n&make=FORD&keywords_display=&color=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=3000&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&seller_type=b&max_mileage=&style_flag=1&sort_type=priceDESC&address=15229&advanced=&end_year=2010&doors=&transmission=&max_price=5000&cardist=246

I tow with a 1995 F-350 2wd crew cab Dually 8 feet bed Power Stroke 5spd with 76,xxx on it. Of course I am only towing a 2200lb neon on an open trailer, but I net 14mpg cruising 75 to 80mph on the highway. Almost all of the F-250's you will find will be a 351 at a minimum. You will also find some 460's as well.
 
I had the following:
1. Custom car hauler made from two 1978 Chevy pickups (to make it really long) - was a drive on. Not enough room in it for people/gear. $1200
2. Ford F150 extra cab long box. another $1200 jobby. Too dang long, and not enough room in it for people and gear.
3. Chevy astro. Forgot what I paid for that. It was great as a race support vehicle but it did eat transmissions and its many engineering faults were intolerable.
4. 1991 Toyota 4Runner. No complaints, worked just fine. Should be able to get one in the price range.
5. VW Touareg (current one). Can't even tell I'm towing anything, but maybe a bit out of the listed price range ;)
 
I Used to tow with a GM 1500, extended cab, 2X4 with a 305. Towed an open trailer great, got 15-16 MPG around town and put studded snow tires on it in the winter and did fine.

How much does a horse trailer and two horses weigh? I would think with the shifting weight of the horses, you would want to go a little heavier??? (coming from a totally ignorant point of view)

I now tow with a 4x4 F150 Super Crew. Shitty gas mileage but great everywhere else but it has the short bed.


Where do you live Jack?
 
My philosophy is that you can tow anything with anything. You just have to adjust your expectations about speed and arrival time.:D I drag my Neon on an open trailer with a 91 318 Dakota 4x4. The closest racetrack to me is 300 miles, into a westerly wind most of the time.

I'm waiting until the price of gas goes way up again, so I can find a V10 Navigator or an 494 cid Sububan for pocket change, then I'll get an enclosed trailer.
 
I picked up my 95 GMC 2500 conversion van for $4200 4 or 5 years ago. It works fine pulling my open trailer. I just fold down the bed when hauling large boards/etc for home projects, or use the trailer for really big stuff.

Mileage sucks at 8-10 towing and 12-14 otherwise, but I only do about 1 oilchange of miles each year.

Having said that I am looking seriously at used diesel or v10 excursions and superdutys. They are not that expensive these days, and have a lot more capability.
 
I had a 96 F150 4X4 and did a ton of towing with a 1 car open trailer. Admitantly I was in my yong 20's and just wanted to get home so I towed at 80-85 all the time. Ended up burning up the rear end on teh way home from a 9 hr tow from Pocono one year. Had to have my friends wife come rescue us with her father in laws F150. Other than that the truck towed great!

I now have a 2000 f350 4X4 7.3 Turbo Diesel Duelly with a fresh engine 2 years ago and you would never now it had a 1 car open trailer on the back. Night and day compairing up hills ect. however everything costs more including the purchase price. Besides the price of Deisel always kills me everytime I pull up to the pump. It gets 15MPG towing or not, no difference.


OH ya almost forgot my original f150 was an Automatice and my new rig is a standard. I would go with a standard both on a cost basis to repair and it is so much better to drive around that 70 mile per hr mark. no upshifting or downshifting on you, how anoying when you pull out to pass or your going up a hill and it is constantly shifting! In my opinion You have much more control of what YOU want the truck doing, even down hills you can pick a gear instead of wearing on your brakes all the way down (MASS Pike heading back east comes to mind) Everyone I knew said I was crazy when I started looking for my F350 in a standard but I kept thinking to myself their has to be a reason Big Rigs (Tractor Trailers) are all Standards...

Good Luck
Stephen Blethen
 
I agree with Stephen on the auto/manual points. My brother has an 00 F350 psd truck as well. He has added a switch to manually lock the torque converter for just this reason. Also had the slushbox rebuilt to a much more bulletproof status at about 125k. If I do go the bigger truck route, it will probably be his truck because of these mods.
 
If you decide to go Diesel--go GM. The Duramax/ Allison is a far better combo than a Ford F250 Powerstroke/Auto.

I drove them all and selected a Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax Crew Cab.

Obviously it is a 4x4--the truck simply will not function on any form of Paddock mud (or winter snow) without it; too nose heavy.

If you go gas, buy the Ford. You can probably get by without 4x4 in a gas small block, but I would not tempt the fates.

I have previously owned three Dakota 4x4(s) which were great for every day driving and occasional towing.

That Duramax, however, tows like a locmotive.
 
Thanks for all the replies -
I guess right now either a F150 or F250 Ext cab 4x4 are the front runners.
There are about 50 F150's near me in my range- about a third are the extended cabs (I want and need) and are 4x4's.
I do worry about the rear axles and the lesser brakes on an 150 though......and quite a few have the 302 or the 4.6. Not too sure they will not be overstressed if I start going on longer and hillier trips towing.
F250's in the spec that I want that have not been plowed are pretty rare around here.
I may jump on the next "owned by an old man" F250 that was never plowed with a 351 4x4 that I see.
Any opinions on C6 vs. the AOD trans? I assume a few more MPG.
I had been looking at the GM Suburban/yukon, ect, but have discounted due too the lack of space for sheet goods or cordwood.
 
We tow with a 2008 F450 Dualie 2wd 6.4L twin turbo diesel.....sure we tow a 18,000 lb 40 ft gooseneck trailer usually full ( no more than 16,000 lb loaded) which is more than most with a race car, but I like the fact of having "too much power" rather than at the limit or close to it. I would look for a F250 with a 7.3 diesel 4wd with the towing package (this makes a difference) and an 8 ft bed. You can't kill the 7.3L motor, more than enough power to pull even an enclosed 10,000 lb trailer loaded and still have a decent ride when not towing and the advantage of 4wd when the weather gets crappy. On occasion I've used the 4wd drive at the track with the trailer hooked up to pull out of what ever swamp had been created by rain. We have a 97 F250 ext cab 4wd that we've had since new. I used to tow my car on an open aluminum trailer and had a cap put on the truck to protect my tools and such. Never was down on power, could cruise at 65-70 all day and got pretty good gas mileage towing (14-16 mpg).
 
FASTJACK said:
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I do worry about the rear axles and the lesser brakes on an 150 though......and quite a few have the 302 or the 4.6. Not too sure they will not be overstressed if I start going on longer and hillier trips towing.
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Click to expand...

I have the 5.4L in my 150 and have no problems with an open trailer with brakes or power. It does have 350lbs of torque........ And I'm very close to the weight limit I'm sure with all the spares, tires and other shit.......

I wouldn't tow an enclosed with it.
 
I am using something that hasn't been mentioned yet. I use a 2002 F250 ext cab long bed with the 6.8L V10.

I pull an aluminum open trailer with a mustang on it and a full long bed. I get 12 miles per gallon and my hauls are always between 4 hours and 12. Nothing nearer.

This truck gives me the option to move up to an aluminum enclosed if I wish. I like the flexibility. I like the difference in price between gas and diesel. I think the savings in oil changes and such with the gas engine.
 
I tow with a 2nd generation 2WD F150 Lightning. 20 foot enclosed, about 7000 lbs all up (~3000lb old school trailer, 2450 lb car, 14 wheels/tires, tool chest, spares kit, 20 gallons gas, and beer). Works great - Daytona, VIR, CMP, Roebling, etc. I do use airbags on the rear springs to hold it level but other than that no issues in probably 15 to 20k of towing over four years. Nary an issue other than the 10-11 MPG I get.
 
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Jack,

given your pricerange, avoid diesel GMs - the older ones were crap. (the new ones are awesome)

if you do go diesel, the ford 7.2 is the motor, the early 6.4s are tempermental and have a lot of issues.

the ford V10 is great, thirsty, but revs and pulls motorhomes with 26" enclosed trailers just fine. should do alright in a pickup.

if you go 150/250 invest in the right upgrades to the trans and diff (coolers, finned cover, rebuilt diff, maybe a better towing gear) and you should be OK on the long pulls. vans never seem as good as the PUs, but I personally prefer them as a vehicle overall. sounds like a good option for you, too. an old ford I6, well cared for, with the right drivetrain will get you by, they are torque monsters, but will show some weaknesses at speed.
 
If you're not dead set against a van, look around for a E350 with the V10. They can be found in the extended body versions relatively easily. I've got an '04 12 passenger (short body) and tow a open trailer (maybe 4K all up) and love the thing.

Gas mileage is comparable or slightly better than the gas V8 because the truck is so understressed - I get 12 @ 70+. Because they are percieved to get lousy MPG they are often available on the cheeep side. Go as new as you can on the V10 - the '99 and down are notorious for spitting sparkplugs out and the (I think, check me) '01 and earlier trans are suspect as well.
 
Tow rig - "beggers cannot be chosers"

Thanks again to all who have posted.
I have pretty clear idea now, comfirming and validating both my own opinions and others I have read elsewhere.
I think an extended cab 4x4 250 with a 351 is my best bet. My current van has 351 (5.4) and has towing power in surplus, but truely sucks in the snow. Most of the diesels I have seen are out of my budget or have 250+ K on them. Not to mention they mostly are 2wd and a bitch to start i the cold.
Finding a F250 4x4 that is not hammered (around here in Ma. they ALL end up as plow trucks at some point, thereby reducing them to hulks of iron oxide with bent frames and smoked trannys ) will be tough though.
An extended van is also on my list, but they are horrible in the snow, and I would like to be able to use the truck or van as a third vehicle for the family if ness, and to tow the impending horse trailer which will mean muddy paddocks......why I want a 4x4.
But to qoute my wise mother "beggers cannot be chosers" so my decsion will likely be based largely on what is available and a good value money wise.....meaning I might go with a E350 van if the right one popped up.
Thanks
Jack
 
Hey Jack! You may want to consider a late 90's Chev suburban 1500 4x4. These can be had for well within your $5000 budget. Most of these things you will find will probably be loaded with all kinds cool stuff, power everything. Equipped with a 350 v8, you will have more than enuff power for towing and taking along a few family and friends. Lose the third row seat and fold down the middle ones and you will have (leave the family at home) cubit footage that rivals any 8 foot bed p/u, and the cargo will stay dry in inclement weather. 4x4 for sure and you will be the king of the road in the deepest snow. I use a '99 burban 2500 with a 454eng. Waaaayyy more than enough car that I need but all worth it.
 
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