A Serious Conflict of Interest in SCCA
- Thread starter tnord
- Start date
on that site.Butch Kummer
New member
Terry Ozment had little or nothing to do with the selection of HPT as the site for the 2006-2008 Runoffs. Tracks submit bids, the BOD (of which Terry is not a member) evaluates the bids and votes. Mid-Ohio and HPT were the only two tracks to submit bids in the last go-round, and HPT won the bid by (IIRC) an 8-5 vote. I was not involved in any of the discussions, but I have no problem believing it was an attempt to appease the West Coast regions after 30 years of towing two-thirds of the way across the country to compete at the Runoffs.
SCCA DOES have problems, but this one is not even in the top twenty.
Butch Kummer, Former Candidate for Area 12 Director
JeffYoung
New member
Butch, what do you think the chances are of a "rotating" Runoffs venue? It seems to me that moving the runoffs on a yearly basis between say Watkins Glen, VIR, Mid-Ohio and Laguna Seca is such a "fair" means of doing this as to be a no brainer. Each region of the country gets to have a "homer" runoffes once every four years, we take the runoffs to high profile tracks around the country instead of Topeka, and we perhaps ultimately make it easier for every national driver to make at least one one runoffs in his/her career.
Is Terry Ozment VP of Club Racing?
Is Ed Ozment the track manager at Heartland Park?
Was Ed Ozment offered the job after the site move announcement was made?
Was Ed Ozment the one that designed the new course layout?
Is Ed Ozment on the Safety Committee?
Is there a light pole on the inside of T2 apex?
Are there spectators standing ~20ft from cars traveling 100+mph with no catch fence?
Are there a significant number of pissed off people defecting to NASA?
Is the success of regional and national racing at all related?
Should we expect a higher or lower turnout than last year come the 2nd weekend in October?
gran racing
Super Moderator
After reading this, I couldn’t help but think that you better darn know for sure and without a doubt the entire situation and surrounding circumstances before making this statement especially in such public forums. This is some pretty strong stuff.
Should Harland Park been automatically disqualified from being considered as a location for the Runoffs? No. The decision should have included several other key members of the National office to proceed, which it sounds like it did.
Do I think the track is boring to watch racing at even though I’m a huge race fan, member of the SCCA, etcetera? <yawn> You better believe it. Maybe the location of the track should rotate among a few different locations in the central US every few years.
Chris Wire
New member
After watching the video of the 'improvements' at HPT from their website, I'd have to concur. Although I've never raced the track, I'd find it hard to get myself excited to go run that track even for a National Championship. And while Mid-Ohio may be a great driver's track, I found watching the Runoffs tedious because the only passing zone on the track ended up being the end of the backstraight. Then follow-the-leader around for the rest of the lap until you hit the backstretch again......yawn.
Unless Road Atlanta and Road America are included, the list is second-rate. Those are argueably the two best racing tracks in the country (see M-O comments above). VIR looks awesome as well.
Just my opinion, of course!
planet6racing
New member
Is it winter already? Funny, I don't see any snow up here and there are at least 2 more events this year!
But, seriously, does anyone have a good recipe for grilled sea bass? (I'm not being a troll, just really tired of these sorts of things)
But, seriously, does anyone have a good recipe for grilled sea bass? (I'm not being a troll, just really tired of these sorts of things)
Butch Kummer
New member
Prior to the fiasco that is the Runoffs at HPT, I would have said the chances of a rotating Runoffs is "zero". If the response on the Runoffs participants' survey doesn't improve dramatically after the changes for 2007, I would guess the BOD would be MUCH more ameniable to trying something new.
The problem with a rotating Runoffs is there are very few tracks in the country that can handle the number of entrants that traditionally have been attending. It's also a major undertaking on the part of the track and they want (at least) a three year deal to justify the commitment they need to make.
My first choice would be to have three "Runoffs" each year, two weeks apart and each with eight different classes. If you're running in SSQ, for instance, this year your championship race is at VIR, next year it's at Mid-Ohio (or Road America), the third year at Laguna Seca. The GT-7 championships are also rotating, but the SSQ cars and GT-7 cars are never at the same track in any given year. There are a LOT more tracks that can host 300 car events (Road Atlanta being among them), "your" Runoffs would be relatively local every three years, plus with eight classes you could do the whole thing in a three-day weekend!
Since I never have any intention of running for Director again, I doubt such a plan will ever see the light of day. The PTB are too hung up on the "Big Event" (the "Olympics of Racing") and don't want "their" championship event(s) spread across the country. If the purpose of the Runoffs is to determine the National Champion in each class my plan gains traction, but that's not the real reason for the Runoffs.
Given the (current) BOD's penchant/desire for a "Big Event", my second choice would be to convince Tony George to rent us the road course at Indianapolis for two weeks each fall.
This should be a separate thread.
Back to tnord's misguided rant against the Ozment Conspiracy...
The problem with a rotating Runoffs is there are very few tracks in the country that can handle the number of entrants that traditionally have been attending. It's also a major undertaking on the part of the track and they want (at least) a three year deal to justify the commitment they need to make.
My first choice would be to have three "Runoffs" each year, two weeks apart and each with eight different classes. If you're running in SSQ, for instance, this year your championship race is at VIR, next year it's at Mid-Ohio (or Road America), the third year at Laguna Seca. The GT-7 championships are also rotating, but the SSQ cars and GT-7 cars are never at the same track in any given year. There are a LOT more tracks that can host 300 car events (Road Atlanta being among them), "your" Runoffs would be relatively local every three years, plus with eight classes you could do the whole thing in a three-day weekend!
Since I never have any intention of running for Director again, I doubt such a plan will ever see the light of day. The PTB are too hung up on the "Big Event" (the "Olympics of Racing") and don't want "their" championship event(s) spread across the country. If the purpose of the Runoffs is to determine the National Champion in each class my plan gains traction, but that's not the real reason for the Runoffs.
Given the (current) BOD's penchant/desire for a "Big Event", my second choice would be to convince Tony George to rent us the road course at Indianapolis for two weeks each fall.
This should be a separate thread.
Back to tnord's misguided rant against the Ozment Conspiracy...
Advice: If you don't know the facts, don't "just make it up".
...was not involved in the final decision to move RunOffs to HPT, and I suspect that she wasn't even VP Club Racing when this decision was made. Unlike you, I won't make up stuff to justify my argument. I don't recall the chronology of the whole thing.
Point ?
Well, if he was, you've just contradicted your previous statement re: Ozment being part of the insidious cabal that hoodwinked the club into moving the RunOffs to HPT.
Don't know, and I certainly wouldn't rely on information that YOU are providing to determine that.
Easily researchable fact. Possibly the only thing you've gotten right in this whole thread.
Apparently, you race there all the time...so is there ? If it's a concern, why do you race there ?
I don't know...are there ? Are they there right now ? You better go warn them.
Define "significant". Hopefully, this is a list longer than "Travis, and the cranks on the Prod board".
I've challenged you to explain why this is true. You have not even attempted to respond.
It will definitely be lower. So what ? That's an issue that is unrelated to your post, or any of the fallacious facts you've "posted" in this thread.
More advice: Stick to your day job, and give up your hopes of leading a grand revolution, at least until you can master the task of crafting an argument with real facts and then adequately defending that argument. You're not up to the task now.
Chris Wire
New member
Now this I could get on board with.
Hmmmm....build an SM or run my RX7 in EP? Decisions, decisions....
Back to your regularly scheduled programming.
dickita15
New member
Things I think I know to be true:
Plans to move the runoffs to other tracks would need tracks to bid to have it. I think there were 3 bids last time and one was withdrawn.
Tony George was asked about the runoffs but at the time a fall date was a problem because Bernie had the authority to move dates. (Maybe not a problem now)
This BB has little interest in these types of discussions.
While in one thread I read we are all leaving for NASA in another thread I read where NASA drove away all the Honda challenge people.
Travis is firmly convinced there is a problem and the lack of hard data (admittedly hard to document) would not prevent getting traction on the prod board.
John is mean to demand people have all the facts.
David is right, regional entries are like 75% of racing entries.
Some national classes have an elevated opinion of their importance.
Plans to move the runoffs to other tracks would need tracks to bid to have it. I think there were 3 bids last time and one was withdrawn.
Tony George was asked about the runoffs but at the time a fall date was a problem because Bernie had the authority to move dates. (Maybe not a problem now)
This BB has little interest in these types of discussions.
While in one thread I read we are all leaving for NASA in another thread I read where NASA drove away all the Honda challenge people.
Travis is firmly convinced there is a problem and the lack of hard data (admittedly hard to document) would not prevent getting traction on the prod board.
John is mean to demand people have all the facts.
David is right, regional entries are like 75% of racing entries.
Some national classes have an elevated opinion of their importance.
Actually, I'm just mean to people who invent their own "facts", and I've been pretty restrained. Some of the posting on this thread deserve a lot more acidic response that has been delivered so far.
Old quote, disputed attribution (Moynihan ? Some other politico ?): "You can have your own opinions, but you can't have your own facts."
Andy Bettencourt
Super Moderator
I am SO glad Patullo is from NER! 
My vote:
Beg TG for a fall date at IRP. Ask him for a Championship level configuration that NOBODY can run for the whole year until the first test day of the Runoffs. Central location, no home field advantage and a world-class facility.
Tony George!!!
My vote:
Beg TG for a fall date at IRP. Ask him for a Championship level configuration that NOBODY can run for the whole year until the first test day of the Runoffs. Central location, no home field advantage and a world-class facility.
Tony George!!!
1) Terry was Director of Club Racing at the time the announcement was made. Go back and read the email i sent.
2) I'm not concerned about the decisions that were made way back when. I'm concerned about what is happening right now, and what decisions will be made in the future. Today, Terry Ozment is VP of Club Racing, and Ed is track Manager at Heartland Park.
3) you are excellent at telling me i'm wrong, but terrible at proving it.
4) i don't see how any reasonable person can say the success of both regional and national racing are at least somewhat related to each other. i'm not even going to waste my time on this one.
5) you'll notice that in the message i did not specify any of the mentioned mistakes as a direct result of the Ozmnt/HPT/SCCA relationship. I never claimed to be privy to any information that would support that. But that doesn't matter to me. I believe the current situation creates a conflict of interest, which regardless of actual influence, should not be allowed to exist.
6) look, i saw a situation i didn't like, and i spoke up about it. if you go back and read the last paragraph of the email i make concessions about my potential misunderstanding about what has happened, and the underlying motivation for the message. if you can't at least respect that, well....
7) I tried to keep the email and thread as polite and professional as possible. congratulations, you ruined it. so i politely say to you "fuck off john. seriously."
2) I'm not concerned about the decisions that were made way back when. I'm concerned about what is happening right now, and what decisions will be made in the future. Today, Terry Ozment is VP of Club Racing, and Ed is track Manager at Heartland Park.
3) you are excellent at telling me i'm wrong, but terrible at proving it.
4) i don't see how any reasonable person can say the success of both regional and national racing are at least somewhat related to each other. i'm not even going to waste my time on this one.
5) you'll notice that in the message i did not specify any of the mentioned mistakes as a direct result of the Ozmnt/HPT/SCCA relationship. I never claimed to be privy to any information that would support that. But that doesn't matter to me. I believe the current situation creates a conflict of interest, which regardless of actual influence, should not be allowed to exist.
6) look, i saw a situation i didn't like, and i spoke up about it. if you go back and read the last paragraph of the email i make concessions about my potential misunderstanding about what has happened, and the underlying motivation for the message. if you can't at least respect that, well....
7) I tried to keep the email and thread as polite and professional as possible. congratulations, you ruined it. so i politely say to you "fuck off john. seriously."
dickita15
New member
agreed though I hope you mean IMS.
indy is a great convetion town. hotels, resturants, blues clubs
John, I probably owe you a smiley.
Travis Lighten Up. read John's posts and think about what he is saying and remember this is the IT board and this type of conversation never works well here.
Andy Bettencourt
Super Moderator
STUPID!
To address your points:
1. It is common knowledge that the SCCA Board of Directors made the decision to move the RunOffs to HPT. The decision wasn't up to anyone named Ozment, and I believe that Mr. Ozment didn't even work at HPT at the time the decision was made. You have repeatedly inferred that there was some Ozment cabal that shanghai'ed the RunOffs to HPT. You are good at tossing shit-bombs until you are challenged, and then you dismiss it as "not important now"
2. See response #1 above, especially the last sentence.
3. You claimed that Nat'l racing provided more entries/income than Reg'l racing. You didn't provide any substantiation to that claim, which any semi-conscious person knows is wrong. Why do I have to prove that you're just "making stuff up" ? Why can't you back up your statements ?
4. "Reasonable people" ? Ha. You can't explain your claim here, either. Explain me this: What has SM Nat'l racing done to SM Regional fields ? How does a strong Nat'l program affect a Region that only hosts Regional races ?
5. Weasel words, again. You've used false facts and innuendo to sling crap, and now you're trying to deconstruct the tower of cards that you've tried to assemble ? You ARE a prize.
6. You've done more than speak up about it...you've demanded a course of action...that would be the "Terry must go or Ed must go" part of your email. Since Ed doesn't seem to work for SCCA, one of those choices seems to be a little problematic, and based on my limited knowledge of contract and employment law, if it was attempted, would likely be "actionable" on Ed's part. Great...everybody gets sued. Other than point out the fact that Terry works for SCCA and Ed works for HPT, what "conflict" have you identified ? None. He doesn't own HPT...he just works there.
7. I started off by simply asking for an explanation of a factual claim (that would be the $$$ of Nat'l vs. Reg'l thing), which you had ass-backwards. You then implied that there was some sleezy 'Ozment plot' to move the RunOffs to HPT, which you could not factually justify. Once we got to that point, you just became 'target practice'. BooHoo. Sorry I made you cry. But, IMO, you are a silly ass who will defame people you've likely never met with false assertions about their positions, actions and motives. You, sir, are a fool.
Edit: (Dick...I knew there was an implied smiley there...)
gran racing
Super Moderator
In light of this you don't see an issue with asking either the SCCA to fire Terry or the track to fire her husband? I am really surprised with that. In one of the other forums, you posted the response that was sent back to you from an SCCA BOD member. Gee, I wonder why some of the tone was a bit defensive?
You also indicate here how your questions were never answered. If you truly want a change, this was a very poor way of attempting to make it happen and much of what you wanted to accomplish was lost. I am hoping this was just a reaction and simply not thought through.