End of Nelson Ledges as we know it?

just spent the weekend at nl and came to three conclusions..

dj10 is way too fast. my fast time for the weekend would have been an ITR record earlier this year...except dj knocked it down even further than he did two weeks ago! nice dan!!

the place needs to be leveled...for the second year in a row at this event there was a horrific crash into the bridge. the layout is fast and fun, and the people are great, but the course is just unsafe. it needs to be brought up to current safety standards.

and it is not 2 miles long as commonly advertised..it is only 1.81..
 
mlytle said:
just spent the weekend at nl and came to three conclusions..

dj10 is way too fast. my fast time for the weekend would have been an ITR record earlier this year...except dj knocked it down even further than he did two weeks ago! nice dan!!

the place needs to be leveled...for the second year in a row at this event there was a horrific crash into the bridge. the layout is fast and fun, and the people are great, but the course is just unsafe. it needs to be brought up to current safety standards.

and it is not 2 miles long as commonly advertised..it is only 1.81..
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DJ is fast, but more power to him. It's not just his car, he himself has the goods.

I agree that the place is unsafe, but I would not change the course configuration. Instead, get rid of the bridge abutment and build tunnels under the track or something and move the damn tire barriers back another 50 yards. Also, create extra run-off in the Carousel and put beaches on the outside of the corners.

I'm not afraid of the place because it's my home track and is where I cut my teeth doing track days and driving schools. It is what it is and I always appreciated the track's unique character...
 
RedMisted said:
Also, create extra run-off in the Carousel and put beaches on the outside of the corners.

...
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Ack...sand belongs at the beach, not the track. Just pave any areas that would get sand/gravel. Cars stop as well or better, don't skip across the surface, or dig in and flip, time isn't wasted digging out, and getting all the crap out of cars is eliminated. (Obviously the paving need not be done to the same standards as the track surface, so it should be more economical) Even if it costs more, than (sand/gravel) it's cheaper in the long run.

And properly stacked and bundled tires do a lot. From the pics I've seen at the place, they are not exactly errrr...well, they're a mess, LOL.
 
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lateapex911 said:
Ack...sand belongs at the beach, not the track. Just pave any areas that would get sand/gravel. Cars stop as well or better, don't skip across the surface, or dig in and flip, time isn't wasted digging out, and getting all the crap out of cars is eliminated. (Obviously the paving need not be done to the same standards as the track surface, so it should be more economical) Even if it costs more, than (sand/gravel) it's cheaper in the long run.

And properly stacked and bundled tires do a lot. From the pics I've seen at the place, they are not exactly errrr...well, they're a mess, LOL.
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Once upon a time @ Summit Point a BUNDLE OF TIED UP TIRES jumped out and hit me! Be careful what you wish for.:(
Like Bridgehampton it's kind of sad to see this historical track change, so many top notch racers have locked their wheels up going into 12. My 1st race there in the 70's was on a 750 Honda in a 4 hr race shared with Eric Buell (who by the way crashed my bike:~) and was my 1st date with my wife of now 32 yrs. I can only hope it won't go by the way side like Bridgehampton.
 
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I've really grown to love the Ledges and I'm not sure how I'll take any track changes. This is my rookie year in the SCCA and I ran the double regional 26/27 July and ran three 1.5 hour stints during the Longest Day last weekend so I do have a fair amount of track time (including quals and practices) there.

On one hand...the course is at times pretty freaking scary. Lots of pucker factor areas if you get off line a bit. I ended up having one of my best races on 26 July and my worst on 27 July when I dipped the left side tires off at T2 and shot across to the inside tire pile...launched and rolled at 80mph. :eek: I almost had the car saved if only the tires were about a foot further back...or stacked nicer instead of being like a ramp.

During the Longest Day last weekend I believe there were around 6-7 cars that rolled in the back, and I think the C&D car even went into the woods.

However, if you can keep it on track, that pucker factor is a real rush. Like someone said before, T1, T2 is a blast, and I love running flat out through the kink without a confidence brake tap or lifting. I don't have any problem with the track surface, but then again I drive a 95 ACR Neon so I'm used to being loose and squirrely. :) Plus, after driving at IRP (ORP) on 5 July I couldn't really complain about anything as long as it was paved. :p

The facilities for both weekends I was there worked fine. It would be nice to not bang my knees on the door of the crapper, but it is indoor plumbing. Same with the showers...it would be nice to not have hot and cold water flashes when someone flushes or washes their hands...but it is a shower and did the trick. I honestly had a bit better crappers and showers while I was in Iraq, but I'm still happy to have had it at Nelson.

It'll be interesting to see what's done and I look forward to it. I'm glad to know I had the opportunity to race on a historic track layout.

Jay Jenkins
#72 ITA Neon
"Snot Rocket"
Murfin Racing
 
To all of the knuckleheads that ran all over the net spreading rumors about things you know not, and making uninformed assumptions like little school girles....THANKS. THANKS A LOT.!!!!
You just about put Nelson out of business...:024:...:bash_1_:


**** SCHEDULE UPDATE *****
Wednesday, September 03, 2008
The rumors are being put to bed for this season. Nelson will continue thru the 2008 schedule and into 2009. That being said, due to these rumors the BMW Event in Sept. and The Pumpkin in Oct. were cancelled.

The FunDay schedule is changing, there are dates added but also dates being dropped so check the calendar.

I would like to thank everyone for their support and for hanging tight during these past few months when things were being turned upside down by all the rumors.

Kerrie

http://www.nelsonledges.com/NNwhatsNewDetail.aspx?newsId=53
 
thedemoguy said:
To all of the knuckleheads that ran all over the net spreading rumors about things you know not, and making uninformed assumptions like little school girles....THANKS. THANKS A LOT.!!!!
You just about put Nelson out of business...:024:...:bash_1_:
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Okay, Mr. DemoGuy.

I started this thread to get to the bottom about Nelson and what was going on with the pending track sale. Everything I wrote on the topic, and MOST of what was written here by others, was thoughtful and based on information gleaned from those who are supposedly "in the know." I'm talking about individuals such as track personnel, SCCA officials, and those who have business connections with the facility.

I'm sure WNY-SCCA and NO-BMWCCA cancelled their events based on conversations with track officials. And of course, nobody told them they had to bail out. Mahoning Valley-SCCA didn't, so why did WNY and BMW?
 
I really liked Nelson. It was like running the same tarmac rally stage over and over for 24 hours. :)

More than a few events have been "canceled because of [insert track-related excuse here]" when the real reason was, "looks like we're going to have so few entries, we can expect to lose money on the deal..."

K
 
Knestis said:
More than a few events have been "canceled because of [insert track-related excuse here]...
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+1. I'm sitting there trying to figure out how a "rumor" could possibly cancel events... And I'm puzzled why a track would actually post that on a public web site (basically saying, "we're in such dire straights that we operate based on rumors...)

:shrug:
 
Greg Amy said:
+1. I'm sitting there trying to figure out how a "rumor" could possibly cancel events...
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It's not the rumors that cause an event to cancel, it is the uncertainty. If a person has a choice between registering for two events, he's going to shy away from the one where there is uncertainty. Uncertainty about the track, the region, whatever.

Once people start to shy away, entries go down and the event is cancelled. This causes a domino effect as uncertainty about other events increases.

Why would you post something like that on your website? what if the vague hope that things will turn out ok is better than reality?

I'm not saying that's the case here. More likely someone's just not thinking about what statements like that look like from the outside. I would have suggested straightforward, accurate information.

What happened to Nelson isn't that different from what happened to the GL schedule in general. Uncertainty about entries led to people not entering events. which lead to events being canceled which led to uncertainty about events. Some events seem to have thrived but other events suffered, whether they deserved to or not.

jim
 
Bottom line:

Economic events have created a situation where there aren't sufficient racers with enough time/resources/undamaged cars, and too many events to choose from.

Nelson suffered not because of rumours (what is this, High School? If the organizers really think that, it's no wonder the place is suffering....), but because Nelson isn't that desirable compared to other options in a time of economic uncertainty.

Supply and demand.

Simple, I think.

But silly to blame it on rumours.
 
Quit tip toeing around the bush! Nelson's needs some CASH dumped into it. It needs to be resurfaced, new curbs and made safer..........period There I said it! Places like Summit Point, just paved, patched, paved & patched again, Watkins Glen & Mid Ohio around, why do I want to beat my car up on some old bumpy ass track!!!??? Unfortunately, everyone involved knows this but it's not sinking into the owners heads yet. HEY NELSON LEDGES OWNERS!!!!!!!!!! IT TAKE $ TO MAKE $! I admit they have been doing some stuff like flush toilets and tons of other maintenance but nothing to the racing surface.
If only I have the money! :~( A great track is a terrible thing to waste.

And please add .19 miles to it to make 2 miles. :~)
 
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My understanding was they HAD a buyer but that buyer backed out. That BUYER was going to invest in the track and refurb the place....not the current owners. The whole "deal" has been rumors because no official word has come from the track to the public.
 
That article dates to June 30, and includes this relevant quote:

Scott Lane, President and General Manager of the facility, said in a telephone interview with Roadracing World today that the sale is in its final stages.

"There's a 99 percent chance that it will be sold, pending some final environmental reviews and some last details," Lane said. "We expect that the sale will be finalized within a month."
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I chuckled when I saw the 99% chance phrase in the same sentence as "environmental reviews".

Then I saw the date.........
 
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