I'll be first to post. Mayhem in ITA at NHIS

B

biovic

New member
Ok, I’ll be the first to post on the ITA race on Saturday at NHIS. I think most of us have just tried to relax on this Memorial Day Monday, and not write on this board to start the comments flying. But I have a few minutes and have a story.
Minding my own business starting 3rd on Saturday, driving down the front straight, before the first corner, cars began bouncing off each other in a domino affect, tagging me (of course others) cars spinning all over the track, probably 7 cars involved, a few out for the race. I kept driving, although I knew my car was in tough shape, just wanted to finish the race. I was in 6th when on the last lap my front tire blew in turn 10 and had to limp the car back in. After surveying the damage to my Teg, out for the rest of the weekend and probably for the next couple months, to get my car back on track if even possible. Damaged rims and tires alone are $1000, then there’s the frame straightening, and undenting EVERY panel on the car (except the rear bumper and the driver side mirror).
So enough about me.
First off, in my 5 years of racing, and probably 45 or so races (I know it’s much less than many of you), I have never, I repeat NEVER, been in a race, seen or even heard of such mayhem BEFORE the first corner of NHIS or ANY racetrack. This type of incident which involved 2 fairly new drivers to NHIS and our regional ITA club should have never happened. The moves by the drivers to try to pass and race along the pit wall by the green VW and blue Nissan were stupid, futile for the track and caused serious damage to not only cars, driver injury (at least one trip to the hospital) and potential for more serious (especially going 80-90mph, not like the typical 30 mph in turn 3), and in my view, a very bad feeling by all drivers and lost camaraderie in our group.
That’s all for now. Video to come soon.

Victor Gangi
03 ITA
 
Okay my turn. I've been racing in ITA/ITC (ITA Civic Si and ITC Honda CRX) since 1996. Let me qualify myself first. I am human, I can, do and have made mistakes. Here is an example of some of my mistakes (once in 1995 in EMRA got my nose in a VW and spun him out on a low speed turn) and a couple of other errors in judgement (an unintentional bump, tire to metal rubs, and off course excerusions). Never have I expereinced the carnage that these newbies to ITA have caused with their racecars.

I've seen some video from other drivers concerning the wreck, I have seen my video and all I can say is that both drivers made a very low percentage (read that as DUMB) moves, that even if the passes were completed would only have taken out more cars, as they would have no place to go after the pass in T-1. I will offer what I beleive happened in a moment.

I was sixth on the grid behind Victor and was turned sideways by the Sentra (JOE!) and helped take out five other innocent bystanders (Victor G.Anthony R, Andy B. Brian M, Eric S), as I was pointed sideways on the front straight. In the process I lost the nose onf my car both fenders, had the drivers door T-Boned by the Green VW (ERIC!), need a radiator support, headlights, a couple of new tires, and need to straighten a kink in my tub a bit, and new bumper covers. Brings on a whole new meaning to "What does $260.00 get you these days at NHIS?"

I also made a couple of laps before I got meatballed for having the nose of my car dragging under the car and finished 22nd. This was supposed a fun weekend and it turned out to be a lot work to make it all worthwhile later and I suspect cost a few grand in repairs. This group of racers are good drivers. None of them desreved these dissappointment, frustration and needless expense and hospital visits. I offer to these two new guys, run with us, learn what we do. I can door handle to door handle with almost all of these drivers and do it with confidence, not fearing a wreck - Racing doesn't need to be a contact sport - We shouldn't even joke about it.

My hope is that the SCCA Officials make note of this incident in the "Red BooK" and make it part of their "Permeant Record".

Here's my take. First I thought after the pace car pulled off we picked up the pace we're pacing too fast which opened up the rear of the field a bit allowing them to get a run. Maybe a wave off would have helped but that wasn't the problem. Joe (Sentra) 10th on the grid, got a good run/start as did Eric (VW). I got a decent start and managed to get next to Victor heading into T-1, plenty of room for both of us. Joe drove his car up next to the pit wall and tried to pass me and got pinched by Eric, also was passing on the pit wall side. Are you counting cars? We are at least 5 maybe 6 wide now. Eric claims he didn't hit Joe, regardless there was no room to go anywhere down there this a low percentage Dumb move. In the video of one of teh other drivers that I beleive will be posted, you will see what appears to be tire rub between the Sebtra ans the VW, but I was told it was "speed dri" not tire. The more I think about it, I believe Joe lost traction in the "speedi dri", got sucked in to the wall and which launched across my nose spinning me sideways. All this before T-1.

So why do I say the move was Dumb aside form the obvious? Joe hasn't raced here for years. otherwise he would have known better. Eric doesn't know the other ITA drivers and whether he hit Joe or not, did not give Joe any room to work and may have had tire to tire rub too - We will never know - Dumb and Dumber. I beleive Joe would have wrecked us anyway if my "speedi dri" theory holds true, but still beleive at eh end of teh straight he would have come across the whole field.

I have to say thank you to Bob Smart (Hoosier Tire), who help piece me together, Robert Willis who lent me the nose of his disabled TEG, and my CPM Motorsports Team ,Ken Schielke, Jerry and Carol Miller for their support and help. These guys were incredible and this team made it possible to pull off a couple of third place finishes coming from the 22nd spot on Sunday after hours of work on Saturday after the wreck. I will public say I apoloigize to the guys I got a piece of, even though they all know I was along for the ride.

You see that's the point. Admit your wrongs, make amends. Don't defend your position - You were both wrong, post it. Public scrutiny is the one way I know to keep people on the up and up. Come and see my bumper. It is there I have added "THANKS JOE !!! THANKS ERIC!!! in magic marker - I plan to keep it there for a while as a reminder of what we are NOT trying to do. My only hope is that by doing so I have not insulted the Corner Workers. Thanks CORNER WORKERS, too - For Real!!!
 
I heard that NHIS was great weekend, but I am sad to see so much carnage in the ITA race. I do not want to add any comments as I was not there, but if anyone has video I would like to see it. Tim I hope to see the Integra out there again and good luck getting it back together. If you need any special Integra knowledge feel free to shoot me an email or give me a buzz.

Congratulations to Greg Amy for the wins! :happy204: :happy204:
 
I'm expecting this to turn into a major brawl. In fact, I think it's very good that we had a few days to all think about last weekend, and possibly even cool off (hopefully, NOT rev up). I personally can offer ZERO unique insight or hindsight to the matter, simply because I didn't personally witness a damned thing. Further, I cannot be objective on the matter, simply because I have friends on every side of this fence.

I do ask for one thing: thought before digging out the poison pen. Think before you post. I am personally aware of at least three useful videos: from inside Joe DiMinno's car, from inside Noam Levine's car (who was immediately trailing Joe), and inside Victor's car. BEFORE EVERYONE STARTS GOING OFF HALF-COCKED, let's all look at the videos and play our best armchair quarterbacking after looking at them.

I don't know that Noam or Victor have posted theirs anywhere, but I do know that Joe has posted his video in the following locations:

A partial slow-motion version:
http://www.sr20forum.com/gallery/showphoto...500/ppuser/2081

A full-speed longer version, 34MB: http://spooled.sr20forum.com/smokinjoe/joe-nhis06.mpg

(the latter one required I download a viewer from http://www.videolan.org/vlc/download-windows.html to view it)

By the way, Tim, I don't think I paced the field too fast as you described. Per my data aquisition, the pace car had us between 29.5 and 30.5 mph through NASCAR 3 and 4 (second gear and about ~3700 RPM for me). I maintained that speed as the pace car sped away and dove into pit lane. Once it was clear of the track I slowly picked up the speed and held the field at 46 mph (second gear and ~5760 RPM for me - as is my prerogative) until the green flag was dropped (even when Brandon got snookered into jumping the start in Race 3). That is hardly what I would call fast. I did the same exact thing all three races... - GA
 
Well I am not going to take as hard of a line as the guys that got collected (go figure). I am the last car through in the slow-mo video you see (dark green Miata with day-glo decals) and consider myself to be rediculously lucky. It was literally 'the big one'.

I started 6th and came through with nobody behind me...freaky really.

There HAD to have been 7 wide. On the right side of the track was Mushnick - Bettencourt - Lawton and on the left was DiMinno - Shiflet - Klavna and in the very middle was Gangi. You can see these 4 from Joe's slo-mo. I was in the middle of the other 3.

The bottom line? When you put yourself against a wall with cars near you, you have left zero room for mistakes. Have I done it? Yup. Was I lucky? Yup. Have I backed out when I thought it was too risky? You bet.

It happened on both sides of the track (Brett Bogart and Jeff Lawton both took me on the outside wall while my torqless wonder clawed for speed) with Gangi in the middle. Shit happened and the metal flew. It sucked.

I watch the races and, although I am new to the class, I already know the guys to be careful around. It's my job to know.

I am glad everyone is ok. Oh ya, I do not belive for 1 second that speedie-dry caused the accident.

AB
 
Wow… that was a crazy weekend. To say the start on Saturday was pathetic is an understatement. So far my season has been 6 minutes and 15 seconds. (April race, Memorial Day race)

From my perspective, I saw Tim’s bright red car sliding across the front on the pack, and the blue Nissan bouncing off cars and the wall to my left. As I slowed, a hole opened up as the Nissan slid left and Tim slid right. I thought I had it made, until a big slam on my right and another on my left. Turns out it was Tim coming off the wall from the right… which sent me into the Nissan on my left. That quick right-left hit gave my melon a good shake so I went to medical where they found tenderness in my upper neck. (I was wearing a HANS) That got me a free ride to the hospital where only strain/bruising of the neck was found.

I want to thank a bunch of people who helped out during the afternoon. First would have to be Maryanne Rhodes (Safety Steward) who knew I needed to go to medical before I did. Brian Mushnick for telling me the walk to medical was free; the ladies with Speedway Ambulance who let me understand the seriousness of my sore neck; my paddock partners Victor Gangi and Noam Levine, for getting my trailer and gear in order. My crew guy Bud who drove all around to get clothes and items to me at the hotel.

From my wife’s point of view, a big thanks to Fred White. He was at turn three with a radio connected to race control and was able to let Lisa know that I drove in and was walking around. She was a rock watching me get strapped to a backboard and carrying a cranky 3-year old around the hospital.

And thanks to all of the competitors and officials who caught up with me to see if I was ok. It is comforting to both my family and I that others are looking out for me, even if I don’t.

This may sound like an Oscar acceptance speech, but I would be remiss if I did not take a moment to let people know that they are appreciated.
 
I know what it's like to be the meat of a multicar sandwich....as a matter of fact, my car is still twisted, which is why I missed this one! (mine happened during qualifying at the Glen, but it was only 4 wide)

But lets see some vids...if they can be posted someplace that doesn't need special registration or downloads, all the better. It sounds as though Noam's is most illuminating...
 
Here is the long-awaited in-car video from Noam Levine. (I haven't downloaded mine yet, but there's not too much to see except the pit wall and a blur from my camera trying to autofocus.)

http://victorgangi.com/media/Memorial_Day_Race_1_crash.wmv

And here is a picture of my car (didn't bother to take a picture of the other side, it looks similar.) I get the auto body assessment tommorow night. Wish me luck.

DSCN2210-488x361.jpg
 
I have to agree with Tim that I thought the start was fast.

In no way do I think it caused the incident, but I think it allowed the field to break apart and scatter much quicker than usual.

2006 GCR Section 7.5-4
"Once the pace car pulls off for the start, the pole car shall maintain the speed of the pace car just prior to pulling off."

Doing the math: 30 mph to 46 mph = 53% increase in speed.
 
I originally thought the start was very fast, up until now... After reviewing my video tonight, and since I was right behind Greg, it wasn't as fast as it 'seemed'. I'll explain.
When the green flag dropped I was just about pegged in 2nd gear, so it was about 50 mph (Greg's speedo read 46, 50 is my estimate, as I can't read my tach speedo that close in the video).
However, what I did notice was we were all going along at about 30 or so through NASCAR turn 3, then the pace car pulled off and Greg sped up through NASCAR turn 4, but then slowed down again (I had to check up and go off the throttle). So if the first couple rows sped up at that point, the rest of the field would have been accelerating through NASCAR turns 3 and 4 to line up close and catch the car directly in front of them. Of course by then the green flag was out for them so it was a fast start for them. In conclusion, it would appear to most of the field that it was a fast start, although it wasn't for us at the front (who eventually ended up at the back). <_<

Victor
 
That was one big rediculous mess.

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Good to hear you're doing ok Anthony. I still can't believe Tim K got his car back together, that was magic
 
http://www.kakashiracing.com/temp/NHIS_CRASH_SLOW_MO.wmv Please right-click and "Save As". If this gets a lot of hits it'll get pulled. If someone else can host it, send me the link and I'll edit this post.
Download that player I linked to for the second one.
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Click to expand...

It think the video pretty much supports the Dumb and Dumber comment - or am I missing something? What were they (JOE! and ERIC!) going to do when they got to the end of the straight away - Fly away???? Call it what you want (inexperience, poor jugment, low percentage move) I'm sticking with Dumb and Dumber - I paid for the privledge. Hey no hard feelings, really - "That's racing" right (I think Jim Carrey and Jeff Daniels coined that phrase)? Please allow to laugh a little - If you don't I'll cry and my neck is still killing me.

Greg - My comment about the start of the race was spot on for acceleration supported by the video, and I believe Anthony's comment of 53% is worthy of consideration.- Not blaming you for anything as orignally stated in my previous post. I also thought that race 3 should have been waved off too - Brandon was three car lengths ahead of you at the green - Again worthy of consideration not pointing fingures (they hurt too).

What is obvious from this video is that Joe had plenty of warning to feather the gas and Eric didn't give him any room to work, on a part of the track that is used for nothing but collecting wrecked cars. Has anyone actually raced against pit wall from this group? Racing down there makes about as much sense as going through T-1 and T-2 at speed, in the marbles, against the wall - It's a wreck waiting to happen. PLEASE!

I am only offering my humble opinion - Not tryng to make any enemies as I have too many friends in "A", as mentioned, I've been racing with many of them since '95. Truth be told who's been racing in "ITA/ITC" in NER longer than me, that was racing at NHIS this weekend? That alone should allow the the privledge to spout off a bit, no??

Keep in mind no one filed a formal inquiry or protest (funny how amnesia works). As far a I know, no one got in an officials face a screamed for action, right? This forum is our opportunity to view video and discuss - If discussion a "brawl" then the injuries from the wreck are much worse than I orignally thought and I really do need my head examined.

The Dilaudid is kicking in for the pain - I gotta go to bed.
 
I know that I should probably leave this for the drivers to discuss, but as Tim's sponsor and as a witness to this incident, I felt I needed to reply to Greg's initial post.
A lot of time, effort and money goes into these race weekends. We do it for fun, for the thrill and for the "comraderie". But when all that is put in jeopardy by a bad judgement call it is hard to stay calm, cool and collected.
Congratulations to you Greg, for your win, but for those of us who will need to spend days and dollars dealing with someone else's mistake, I think a little passion is justified.
 
Just to add fuel to an already raging fire, heard it from the horse's mouth, the starter was given strict instructions to not wave off anything in the interest of the schedule! May not have made a difference in your race, but there were some very badly bunched starting fields!
 
OK, my turn............ Since I was the last one collected in the mess...... I managed to get a good run and was headed up the outside wall and got collected by Brian. I was lucky enough to be able to get the car back together and aligned although I had a bent sub frame and two blown shocks (thnk god for plastic body parts!!)......... It sucked for everyone involved..........

Anthony, glad you're OK. I hadn't even realized anyone got hurt!! Of course, I spent the rest of the weekend under my car so I was a little out of it.....

Tim gets the "rising from the ashes award"!! :OLA: And the best sense of humor!!

In my opinion:
Joe's attempt was risky but if I saw that much open track and was coming like a freight train, even I would have tried it (and I have no balls!!) He would have made it if Eric realized he was there........ Speedy dry my a$$.

Eric looked like he came out of it OK, but he got off the brakes and looks like he was back on the gas when he plowed into Tim. I think that was one hit that could have been avoided.

As far as the start in the last race?? I think that was a great move by Brandon!! Here is is sitting next to the guy who just broke the track record, having a snow balls chance in hell of wining the race, why not go for it!! The worst they could do is wave off the start!! :lol:

I too will be missing the next couple of races. Unfortunately my reapirs are going to be a little more difficult than I had anticipated.. :mad1:

I don't hold anyone responsible. I don't think any protest would have been upheld. That's racing..........


Again, just one person's opinion...........
 
Current Count of Cars Wrecked = 8

I know that we cannot point to any one item that caused the carnage this weekend. Like with many big accidents, there was a multitude of things that went wrong.

I look forward to racing with everyone again this season and share in the after party beers. Just not sure when that will be.
 
in my oppinion joe should have backed out.the vw was in front and he was coming to the left which left no room for joe.yeah he had a run but as you can see by the results, the risk was not worth it.the start did not help but we all have gas pedals and brake pedals to control our cars.not the starts fault.
i will expand that spec miata has this problem. a guy in front looses momentum. the 2 cars behind him get a run. they all stick it into the next corner and someone gets the short end of the stick.that is why i left SM. no give or take. rick
 
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