And turbos in IT? That would be a ruinous, unholy mess, particularly if anyone is even REMOTELY thinking about balancing them with NA cars.
K
Given the number of cars that are coming with turbos what do you do to stay relevant?
And turbos in IT? That would be a ruinous, unholy mess, particularly if anyone is even REMOTELY thinking about balancing them with NA cars.
K
Given the number of cars that are coming with turbos what do you do to stay relevant?
Let the st guys figure that out
THat's the thing though. I think the very few outliers we have to deal with -- the Audi, the MR2, the Volvos -- make it seem like we are trying so hard to get it right on the money. When in reality the idea is get it close and let folks race.
Yeah, 50 lbs matters. Yeah it matters more in ITB. But would it prevent me from making a car choice as a result? I guess it could, but lots of other stuff WITHIN THE DRIVER'S control matters more.
I think most of the ITAC, no all of us really, does just about that above. Where it gets screwy is on the 25% default rule. If we have evidence -- and on track creeps in sometimes although I can't say we've ever made a change based on it -- then it can be hard to ignore.
If you have 7/8 dyno plots on a particular car not making 25%, a single car, do you just ignore it? I don't think you can as you lose just as much credibility that way.
Given the number of cars that are coming with turbos what do you do to stay relevant?
"To refresh everyone....
What we have is a case of multiple (and findable) sources that list 110 and a microfiche (and unfindable) source that lists 120, correct?
- Is the microfiche for an unmodified US car as sold in the US?
- What is the source of the microfiche (factory publication? trade magazine?)
- What is the citation for the microfiche so that those with an axe to grind can go to a research library and do some digging?
- Was the 120 BHP, SAE Gross, SAE Net or SAE certified?"
"Can't find that microfiche, it doesn't exist. "
The truth about this was put out to this community from several members.
This repetition of the "microfiche" untruth reminds me of this election season-if you repeat misinformation enough, it will become the truth.
The 120hp specification for the Coupe motor is found in the VW/Audi factory dealer parts information system known as EKTA, which is disseminated to every factory authorized VW and Audi dealer in the US and exists as a digital file on their computer systems.
It is the only system the factory provides authorized service and parts departments to use for parts ordering/identification purposes. It also lists all engine and transmission codes, including certain specifications and applicability, as well as many other minutia needed to understand what fits what and when it was in production, etc. Many people involved in the service and repair of VAG vehicles, like Phils Foreign Car Service, or VAG parts re-sellers, or VAG car developers, have acquired bootleg copies of the files because they are the latest, official factory information. AFAIK, the information from the engine spec section can be printed from my computer just as any parts illustrations and accompanying printed info can be and I would gladly do for any who's interested if it's possible.
And on another planet, far away...... You're collectively killing this class with a death of a thousand cuts. I reluctantly approved of the attempts to quantify performance using "the process", but feared it would come to this bullshit. Everyone and His Highness' Royal (RIGHT) opinion screaming for attention! And whoever is the loudest gets listened to. A long time ago I opined that this "club" should be ruled by an enlightened dictatorship. That's still true.
If the most vocal of you spent half the energy you spend on this forum and put it into learning and pursuing car development/tuning, you would be a lot faster and satisfied!
"To refresh everyone....
What we have is a case of multiple (and findable) sources that list 110 and a microfiche (and unfindable) source that lists 120, correct?
- Is the microfiche for an unmodified US car as sold in the US?
- What is the source of the microfiche (factory publication? trade magazine?)
- What is the citation for the microfiche so that those with an axe to grind can go to a research library and do some digging?
- Was the 120 BHP, SAE Gross, SAE Net or SAE certified?"
"Can't find that microfiche, it doesn't exist. "
The truth about this was put out to this community from several members.
This repetition of the "microfiche" untruth reminds me of this election season-if you repeat misinformation enough, it will become the truth.
The 120hp specification for the Coupe motor is found in the VW/Audi factory dealer parts information system known as EKTA, which is disseminated to every factory authorized VW and Audi dealer in the US and exists as a digital file on their computer systems.
It is the only system the factory provides authorized service and parts departments to use for parts ordering/identification purposes. It also lists all engine and transmission codes, including certain specifications and applicability, as well as many other minutia needed to understand what fits what and when it was in production, etc. Many people involved in the service and repair of VAG vehicles, like Phils Foreign Car Service, or VAG parts re-sellers, or VAG car developers, have acquired bootleg copies of the files because they are the latest, official factory information. AFAIK, the information from the engine spec section can be printed from my computer just as any parts illustrations and accompanying printed info can be and I would gladly do for any who's interested if it's possible.
And on another planet, far away...... You're collectively killing this class with a death of a thousand cuts. I reluctantly approved of the attempts to quantify performance using "the process", but feared it would come to this bullshit. Everyone and His Highness' Royal (RIGHT) opinion screaming for attention! And whoever is the loudest gets listened to. A long time ago I opined that this "club" should be ruled by an enlightened dictatorship. That's still true.
If the most vocal of you spent half the energy you spend on this forum and put it into learning and pursuing car development/tuning, you would be a lot faster and satisfied!
And does anyone have any of the CRB's emails so I can request a copy of the microfiche ?
Where is the Audi located?
We get 3-4 runs for 50$. I take 2 cars most of the time.
I'll pay for Audi ITB dyno time if it'll but this damn issue to bed.
Re:Audi and a dyno.
Perhaps I am mistaken... but isn't the stock HP number the issue and not the IT-trim motor? If that's the case, how would a dyno of a motor that has had any modifications illuminate the answer?
Thank you for giving the source. It still leaves unanswered the question as to how the document is measuring horsepower and whether the engines were sold in the US in the car. Using wiki, there were 4 different engines in the car:
HY= 134 BHP less 15% = 114HP
JT= 119 BHP less 15% = 101HP
KV = 131 BHP less 15% = 111HP
KX = 118 BHP. less 15% = 100HP
According to www.audiworld.com, the 84 version had 100 HP (SAE net) which corresponds to... 119BHP. And if that easily could have been 120BHP in the source.
But the Audi is a red herring. The CRB has ruled by decree on it. The larger issue is does anyone know where I can find either a Geo Prism GSi, Isuzu Stylus or Geo Storm GSi that I can convert into an ITB car?