The Devil in the Dark 2014
- Thread starter Terry Hanushek
- Start date
Terry Hanushek
Member
Dave
What Kirk said .... Plus
Page 5 / S P E C I A L . E V E N T . R U L E S / 7. Car Modifications
This provision was added several years ago after a team was observed placing a spare tire in their car with about an hour to go. The car was weighed with and without the spare tire in post race impound. Much to the relief of the crew, the car made weight by about three pounds without the spare tire. We do what we can to level the playing field.
See ya at races
Terry
What Kirk said .... Plus
Page 5 / S P E C I A L . E V E N T . R U L E S / 7. Car Modifications
With the exception of consumable items (fuel, oil, water, tires and brake pads), nothing may
be added or changed on the car in the last hour without the permission of the Chief Steward or representative.
This provision was added several years ago after a team was observed placing a spare tire in their car with about an hour to go. The car was weighed with and without the spare tire in post race impound. Much to the relief of the crew, the car made weight by about three pounds without the spare tire. We do what we can to level the playing field.
See ya at races
Terry
Flyinglizard
New member
Most of my Chump team loves the night races. And FWIW the Chump and lemons races have moved a liitle away from overnight 24s and night racing in general.
Maybe Terry can find a market gap and fill it .
IMHO the night races are what makes an endurance race cool. Sunrise over the pack is just the nuts.
RE pace car; The steward could designate 3 or 4 ¨pace cars"among the race cars . Yes the pace car situation can add or subtract a lap for the front teams very easy. As the intensity / cost go up,. these things matter more to teams that are out for the win, overlooking the fun factor .
We stopped the 12 at the point when fuel rigs were allowed and the nightt running was reduced, making the race just a long race that required fuel rigs to be near the front. The lack of fuel cell size rules also dampened our enthusiasm.
Maybe Terry can find a market gap and fill it .
IMHO the night races are what makes an endurance race cool. Sunrise over the pack is just the nuts.
RE pace car; The steward could designate 3 or 4 ¨pace cars"among the race cars . Yes the pace car situation can add or subtract a lap for the front teams very easy. As the intensity / cost go up,. these things matter more to teams that are out for the win, overlooking the fun factor .
We stopped the 12 at the point when fuel rigs were allowed and the nightt running was reduced, making the race just a long race that required fuel rigs to be near the front. The lack of fuel cell size rules also dampened our enthusiasm.
^I think in E1 and E2 you might need a fuel rig and big cell to win this one. But in the lower classes I'm not at all convinced. I witnessed enough of a delta in car and team prep, and DRIVING ability, that some time + or - in the pits didn't make that huge of a difference. IOW, if you maximized the result from what you had in hand, you were probably way further ahead than guys that had rigs and stuff and didn't execute otherwise.
That said, I have to give props to the guys in the E3 and particularly E4 cars that were top 10 OA. They had to be on point.
Will
That said, I have to give props to the guys in the E3 and particularly E4 cars that were top 10 OA. They had to be on point.
Will
StephenB
New member
4th overall = E2 car with terrible gas mileage (rx8) with a stock 13 gallon tank fitted with a single hose dry break to use dump cans. Used 1 set of street tires Saturday. May use the same tires later this year. Top speed on the car was 115 with no 5th or 6th after the first hour.
Driver out with 10 seconds, driver in and car moving within 20 to 30 seconds. If your pit stop took you more than 2:45seconds then we lapped you
ours were all about 1:15.
Driver out with 10 seconds, driver in and car moving within 20 to 30 seconds. If your pit stop took you more than 2:45seconds then we lapped you
ours were all about 1:15.Had we been equipped with our typical 22-gallon cell and dump cans, we would have made three stops (rather than six), and they would have averaged about half the time we spent on each one. How many laps is that...?
K
Enough laps for you to beat us, doc! 
We made 6 by my count too, plus one during a fcy for a radio cluster eff. We used dead stock fill jugs with the stock fill neck on the car, flapper still intact. We stood still for at least 4 minutes, which was horrible. So yeah, we gave up some laps just due to a non ideal setup.
I want to keep the car Chump eligible, and they only allow +2 gallons from stock in a cell, which IMO may not be worth it for us.
I guess we just work on getting more speed to make up for our short runs!. We were like 400 pounds plus heavy for the LCC rules, there's speed there.
W
We made 6 by my count too, plus one during a fcy for a radio cluster eff. We used dead stock fill jugs with the stock fill neck on the car, flapper still intact. We stood still for at least 4 minutes, which was horrible. So yeah, we gave up some laps just due to a non ideal setup.
I want to keep the car Chump eligible, and they only allow +2 gallons from stock in a cell, which IMO may not be worth it for us.
I guess we just work on getting more speed to make up for our short runs!
. We were like 400 pounds plus heavy for the LCC rules, there's speed there. W
Terry Hanushek
Member
Is supremacy in E5 becoming a grudge match?
T
T
If we can call you 'Humpy Wheeler' Hanushek, and it gets more people interested in LCC/E5, then hell yes!
Reg was ugly. VERY ugly and people lost track time as a result. I don't understand how it could have ever been scheduled the way it was. The volunteer excuse doesn't cut it, there were many people new to SCCA that were SLAPPED in the face by this. AND PEOPLE LOST TRACK TIME THEY PAID FOR.
My drivers went to reg early and WERE TURNED AWAY!!!
LED's bugged out one of my drivers as well... especially regarding closing rate. There are small bars. maybe out law the long ones or make them tape the middle third?
15 votes for 12 to 12. If staying up late is a problem, get up later. The dark that we get with 12 to 12 is SO much more in the spirit of a true endurance race. I partied until 4 with my drivers and was the youngest one there by a mile so age is no excuse
The pit exit closing on that early yellow was VERY RUDE.
Great event sans the reg and the pits/pace car bit. I swore I was going to drive this year, but brought a team of drivers together with a car and chiefed it instead... Most fun and best experience I've had not driving in a while. Crew chief, Driver changer and spotter... It kept me busy... The Sunday I packed up a different car and drove to the Glen. Good times.
I'm very very VERY much against changing the time. Unless it is to go later...
Please don't let it happen. The event is growing and people like it the way that it is.
My drivers went to reg early and WERE TURNED AWAY!!!
LED's bugged out one of my drivers as well... especially regarding closing rate. There are small bars. maybe out law the long ones or make them tape the middle third?
15 votes for 12 to 12. If staying up late is a problem, get up later. The dark that we get with 12 to 12 is SO much more in the spirit of a true endurance race. I partied until 4 with my drivers and was the youngest one there by a mile so age is no excuse
The pit exit closing on that early yellow was VERY RUDE.
Great event sans the reg and the pits/pace car bit. I swore I was going to drive this year, but brought a team of drivers together with a car and chiefed it instead... Most fun and best experience I've had not driving in a while. Crew chief, Driver changer and spotter... It kept me busy... The Sunday I packed up a different car and drove to the Glen. Good times.
I'm very very VERY much against changing the time. Unless it is to go later...
Please don't let it happen. The event is growing and people like it the way that it is.
Terry Hanushek
Member
Chris
We are aware of (and embarrassed by) the difficulties in registration. It won't happen again.
Also understand that registration for this event will cause delays when most teams show up at the same time with a dozen or more crew members some of whom need weekend memberships. We can't completely eliminate delays but we can ensure that it will not intrude on practice or race time.
Some place, perhaps on another BBS, there was a discussion of LED's and possible solutions. We are looking at cutting the beam at or below horizontal to retain the advantage of LED while not annoying / interfering with other drivers. Your suggestions are welcome.
I'm glad you enjoyed the event and hope to see you out next year.
Terry
We are aware of (and embarrassed by) the difficulties in registration. It won't happen again.
Also understand that registration for this event will cause delays when most teams show up at the same time with a dozen or more crew members some of whom need weekend memberships. We can't completely eliminate delays but we can ensure that it will not intrude on practice or race time.
Some place, perhaps on another BBS, there was a discussion of LED's and possible solutions. We are looking at cutting the beam at or below horizontal to retain the advantage of LED while not annoying / interfering with other drivers. Your suggestions are welcome.
I'm glad you enjoyed the event and hope to see you out next year.
Terry
Chris,
Lighten up. It was another great event by the NJ folks. Well constructed ositive suggestions always help to improve future events. And it was us old guys who taught you how to party til 4. Maybe later we'll show you how to take it til dawn.
Your friend Chuck
Just being brief and yes it was a GREAT event overall! Just wanted to make a couple points, not trying to beat a dead horse. Sorry I couldn't find you to say hi Chuck. I tried to catch your eye during the driver meeting, but you may not have recognized me with my hair cut...
It was EPIC! Shoulda been there jerk
Thank Terry x10!
Understood about the Reg. Let me know next time if you are short volunteers, or they don't want to start early, I will help!
Biggest issue with the LED bars seemed to be judging the closer rates. I don't think that lowering the light will do much as the regular highs are... well pretty high, might not hurt though.
Amazing the turnout. can't wait for next year! My drivers all got hooked and are taking me with them where ever they go next... Currently planning for the 13 hour
Watching it again this weekend, what lemons does very right registration-wise is decoupling and people...
** There's a list of every registered participant at the front gate. Anyone on that list gets a blue wristband. That list is a simple dump of anyone listed as crew or drivers and nobody cares which car you're attached to. If folks need temporary weekend memberships at an SCCA weekend, this would be the place to take care of it.
** Car "registration" and tech requires only one person serving as the representative of the team. For an SCCA race this could be the entrant and/or the registered DTR. This is what they tried to do - sort of - at the Devil, when they just asked for a person to get cars registered but it was in the mess of a bunch of people already in line to do weekend memberships, etc.
** Driver check-in just requires showing your license and printing/signing against a list of just drivers - literally just highlighted as each is processed. That gets one a yellow wrist band.
** With gear annuals, SCCA wouldn't have to do this, but driver gear tech includes pulling out your stuff, (literally) pointing at the SFI (blech) patch/sticker, and raising your hand when you're ready for the rotating guy. Interestingly, this approach - at every race - does a better job of encouraging proper gear than does the annual approach, under which I could be using a non-approved suit under my stickered helmet...
The approach at SCCA enduros continues the regular system that's centered on the driver, and assumes he/she has a car and crew.
K
EDIT - Implicit in the above is that these functions take place in different lines. Spread them out and let each work at its own rate.
** There's a list of every registered participant at the front gate. Anyone on that list gets a blue wristband. That list is a simple dump of anyone listed as crew or drivers and nobody cares which car you're attached to. If folks need temporary weekend memberships at an SCCA weekend, this would be the place to take care of it.
** Car "registration" and tech requires only one person serving as the representative of the team. For an SCCA race this could be the entrant and/or the registered DTR. This is what they tried to do - sort of - at the Devil, when they just asked for a person to get cars registered but it was in the mess of a bunch of people already in line to do weekend memberships, etc.
** Driver check-in just requires showing your license and printing/signing against a list of just drivers - literally just highlighted as each is processed. That gets one a yellow wrist band.
** With gear annuals, SCCA wouldn't have to do this, but driver gear tech includes pulling out your stuff, (literally) pointing at the SFI (blech) patch/sticker, and raising your hand when you're ready for the rotating guy. Interestingly, this approach - at every race - does a better job of encouraging proper gear than does the annual approach, under which I could be using a non-approved suit under my stickered helmet...
The approach at SCCA enduros continues the regular system that's centered on the driver, and assumes he/she has a car and crew.
K
EDIT - Implicit in the above is that these functions take place in different lines. Spread them out and let each work at its own rate.
georgethefierce
New member
I asked over on the "other" place but should plop it in here too, are Prod cars not eligible for this race?