gran racing
Super Moderator
I realize that this topic might not be the wisest discussion for me to bring up and I should probably put a big target on my poor blue CRX, but many people including myself feel this needs to be further addressed.
The purpose of this discussion is to see how we could reduce cheating in IT racing, but it could useful in other classes as well. I’m not sure it matters too much why people cheat, other then to address possible issues that often lead to it. With the proposed PCAs, hopefully some of the temptation will be reduced. But that’s another discussion.
Cheating happens on all levels of racing – it is just a fact and it will probably always happen. But more could be done to discourage cheating and catch those who do. Often times I feel cheating occurs due to a trickle down effect. A person believes that another racer who is faster is cheating (whether true or not), then begins to cheat themselves. It just seems to snowball. Other times people feel that their car is misclassed and their only way to be competitive is to cheat. Of course there is also the belief that you they won’t be caught. I’m sure that a person who is cheating has some rationale behind it. And it doesn’t mean that they are a bad person. Wouldn’t it be much easier if people knew everyone else is legal and the ramifications of cheating are just too great to risk it? I would imagine things would be made much easier and less stressful even for those who are currently cheating.
I have spoken with many tech inspectors in different regions. Often times they can’t help but chuckle at some of the things that they see and that nothing is done about it. And the tech inspectors or other workers should NOT be put in a position to protest cars. Besides, they are volunteers helping us and shouldn’t have to worry about this task. And I’m not talking about “minor” illegal items, but things such as cams. I have also spoken with several engine builders. The first time it came up I was really caught off guard. Guess I was just being naïve before. The builder goes on to explain what they could do to the engine, and the gains that could be seen. Wow! Often times this build is even cheaper then if they were to build a legal engine and it sure would have more power. It has been explained that they build these “cheater” engines for many SCCA racers. (Whether this is true or not, who knows) They then go on to explain that it is such a remote chance you’ll be caught because there is no easy way to determine that it is illegal unless it is torn down.
At this point, you might be asking then why don’t you protest a car that you feel is cheating? There are many reasons why people don’t protest. For a mid-pack driver like myself, I just don’t bother. If I finish 20th or 19th, does it really matter? There are also several other reasons. People also don’t want to ruffle any feathers and make enemies. These are just a few common reasons, but there are many more.
Is there a way to implement a method that does not require an individual process the protest and be “the bad guy”? It should still be possible for people to protest someone else’s car; this would be in addition to the other new method. This method would need to make sure it is not too intrusive and a pain in the butt for non-cheaters.
Possible methods? This is where we need to do some thinking; I honestly do not know what the real answer is. In another previous post, the idea was somewhat jokingly suggested of doing a potluck raffle. But hey, maybe something like that could work? Maybe do random item checks of miscellaneous things (much more than now) on the top finishing cars. Possibly open this random check up to the top 1/3 of the field. Have a list of the current “hot cheater items” to look for and the related cost to evaluate them. For example: Higher then allowed compression (cheap to check), cams (log book I have says $100 to test), and etcetera. How do you pay for the cost of these random inspections? Make it a part of the entry fee. Maybe build a “You Better be Legal” fund. In one race don’t inspect any cars in great detail (like now); in another do several checks. I’d be more than willing to pay $5.00 more to ensure more cars are legal.
Publish the list of cheaters in FasTrack – “Hall of Shame.” Include the car, person’s name, region, what they got caught for. It should not include people who are in violation of “minor” items (would need to come up with a list of what is deemed minor).
Stiffer penalties need to be imposed then currently are listed. Maybe if a driver is caught with an illegal cam, ban them for 365 days from all SCCA racing. Right now (and I could be wrong), it is like being warned that if you go 100 mph in a 55 mph zone the police officer will delay you for up to ½ hour on the side of the road. Get caught more then 8 times in three years, and you’ll lose your drivers license for up to a year. I know, this is a bit of an exaggeration but you get the point.
Before implementing the new methods I certainly do not think it would be such a bad thing to make it very public that at the end of the season, if your car is currently illegal you better use the off-season to make it legal. By doing it this way, it gives people the opportunity who have gotten caught in the snowball to correct things. We also need to realize that someone might have something illegal and simply is not aware of it. The violation also needs to fit the punishment. This could be another big discussion on its own.
Why not make IT a beta for a new method to regulate illegal cars? Many of us complain about it (whether founded or not) – shouldn’t something be done? What can be done for the future – the past is the past.
Please provide your ideas, suggestions, and thoughts on what could be done realistically and fairly. Of course we’re not going to tear down the entire field; not silly stuff like that. Hopefully people won’t just react to this or twist things around.
In any replies to this thread, DO NOT mention any specific cars or people that you think or know are cheating.
------------------
Dave Gran
NER #13 ITA
'87 Honda Prelude
The purpose of this discussion is to see how we could reduce cheating in IT racing, but it could useful in other classes as well. I’m not sure it matters too much why people cheat, other then to address possible issues that often lead to it. With the proposed PCAs, hopefully some of the temptation will be reduced. But that’s another discussion.
Cheating happens on all levels of racing – it is just a fact and it will probably always happen. But more could be done to discourage cheating and catch those who do. Often times I feel cheating occurs due to a trickle down effect. A person believes that another racer who is faster is cheating (whether true or not), then begins to cheat themselves. It just seems to snowball. Other times people feel that their car is misclassed and their only way to be competitive is to cheat. Of course there is also the belief that you they won’t be caught. I’m sure that a person who is cheating has some rationale behind it. And it doesn’t mean that they are a bad person. Wouldn’t it be much easier if people knew everyone else is legal and the ramifications of cheating are just too great to risk it? I would imagine things would be made much easier and less stressful even for those who are currently cheating.
I have spoken with many tech inspectors in different regions. Often times they can’t help but chuckle at some of the things that they see and that nothing is done about it. And the tech inspectors or other workers should NOT be put in a position to protest cars. Besides, they are volunteers helping us and shouldn’t have to worry about this task. And I’m not talking about “minor” illegal items, but things such as cams. I have also spoken with several engine builders. The first time it came up I was really caught off guard. Guess I was just being naïve before. The builder goes on to explain what they could do to the engine, and the gains that could be seen. Wow! Often times this build is even cheaper then if they were to build a legal engine and it sure would have more power. It has been explained that they build these “cheater” engines for many SCCA racers. (Whether this is true or not, who knows) They then go on to explain that it is such a remote chance you’ll be caught because there is no easy way to determine that it is illegal unless it is torn down.
At this point, you might be asking then why don’t you protest a car that you feel is cheating? There are many reasons why people don’t protest. For a mid-pack driver like myself, I just don’t bother. If I finish 20th or 19th, does it really matter? There are also several other reasons. People also don’t want to ruffle any feathers and make enemies. These are just a few common reasons, but there are many more.
Is there a way to implement a method that does not require an individual process the protest and be “the bad guy”? It should still be possible for people to protest someone else’s car; this would be in addition to the other new method. This method would need to make sure it is not too intrusive and a pain in the butt for non-cheaters.
Possible methods? This is where we need to do some thinking; I honestly do not know what the real answer is. In another previous post, the idea was somewhat jokingly suggested of doing a potluck raffle. But hey, maybe something like that could work? Maybe do random item checks of miscellaneous things (much more than now) on the top finishing cars. Possibly open this random check up to the top 1/3 of the field. Have a list of the current “hot cheater items” to look for and the related cost to evaluate them. For example: Higher then allowed compression (cheap to check), cams (log book I have says $100 to test), and etcetera. How do you pay for the cost of these random inspections? Make it a part of the entry fee. Maybe build a “You Better be Legal” fund. In one race don’t inspect any cars in great detail (like now); in another do several checks. I’d be more than willing to pay $5.00 more to ensure more cars are legal.
Publish the list of cheaters in FasTrack – “Hall of Shame.” Include the car, person’s name, region, what they got caught for. It should not include people who are in violation of “minor” items (would need to come up with a list of what is deemed minor).
Stiffer penalties need to be imposed then currently are listed. Maybe if a driver is caught with an illegal cam, ban them for 365 days from all SCCA racing. Right now (and I could be wrong), it is like being warned that if you go 100 mph in a 55 mph zone the police officer will delay you for up to ½ hour on the side of the road. Get caught more then 8 times in three years, and you’ll lose your drivers license for up to a year. I know, this is a bit of an exaggeration but you get the point.
Before implementing the new methods I certainly do not think it would be such a bad thing to make it very public that at the end of the season, if your car is currently illegal you better use the off-season to make it legal. By doing it this way, it gives people the opportunity who have gotten caught in the snowball to correct things. We also need to realize that someone might have something illegal and simply is not aware of it. The violation also needs to fit the punishment. This could be another big discussion on its own.
Why not make IT a beta for a new method to regulate illegal cars? Many of us complain about it (whether founded or not) – shouldn’t something be done? What can be done for the future – the past is the past.
Please provide your ideas, suggestions, and thoughts on what could be done realistically and fairly. Of course we’re not going to tear down the entire field; not silly stuff like that. Hopefully people won’t just react to this or twist things around.
In any replies to this thread, DO NOT mention any specific cars or people that you think or know are cheating.
------------------
Dave Gran
NER #13 ITA
'87 Honda Prelude
